Welfare system / Health care(less)

I was talking to my Brother-in-law in the UK yesterday.  He told me two things that really irked me and solidified my choice in crossing the pond almost 30 years ago.

Seems that immigrants into the UK,  are able to get child support for their children even though their children still reside in their native land.  This applies even to those immigrants who do not necessarily qualify for legal status, just as long as they have applied for it. In the UK every citizen and resident is elligible for a Child Allowance for each child up to the age of 16 years, as I recall.  I don't know how much the Child Allowance is today but it was paid in the form of a voucher every two weeks, which could be cashed at Post Offices.  I'm sure one of our UK members can fill in other details or clarify while my blood boils.  Please say it ain't so...  I guess the British Government's philosophy is that it is cheaper to send the money abroad than to educate, school and otherwise tend to the kids if in the UK.  Of course there wouldn't be any abuse of the system, would there???

The second issue was regarding a mutual friend, also in the UK who has had a history of heart related problems, including a couple of double by-pass surgeries, strokes, high BP, high cholesterol and Angina.  He was recently on vacation in the South of England and sufferred yet another heart attack. (his 3rd or 4th).    His wife rushed him to the nearest Emergency room where he was treated, stabilized and allowed to leave after a few days.  His wife drove him back home and within a couple of days sufferred several bouts of Angina.  Fearing the worst he was again rushed to their local ER.  Obviously this guy is now in a fairly serious condition, wouldn't ya' think - given his history.    What was the best they could do?  -  offer him an appointment with a 'specialist' almost three weeks away!!!!  OR (and I like this one even more)...allow his wife to transport him back to the hospital in the south of England - almost 300 miles away (where he was taken following his latest heart attack while on vacation) because his 'wait time' would be less than a week as long as no other patient in need of more urgent care, didn't beat him to the bed.    Ain't  socialized medicine grand ?

Tom, I know you will like those...

BT 

BT,

I hear many tales when I talk with family in the UK.

A few years ago, Chris' Dad needed bypass surgery and was put on a waiting list to get on the real waiting list. Can't recall if it was 9 or 12 months later that his turn came. He went into hospital, was prep'd for surgery, then they sent him home and told him to come back the following week for surgery. As you might recall, government-paid surgeons have a right to certain number of beds for their private patients. After Chris' Dad had been prep'd, the surgeon decided he needed the bed for one of his private patients, and he was bumped literally from the operating table.

The welfare issue used to make my blood boil when we still lived there. I recall falling down stairs and being in a lot of pain for a week, but continued to go to work every day. A week later, still in pain, I decided to visit the doctors' clinic that happened to be next door to our house. The receptionist asked me for my name and address - she'd never seen me before. Right behind me came a guy who refused to work. He had 5 kids and was better off financially, thanks to government handouts, including unemployment &/or national insurance, free rent, and child support. The receptionist knew him by name and asked if he was there for his usual "doctor's paper", aka a continual excuse to not work. The guy knew how to work the system, and he milked it. Oh, almost forgot, the doc diagnosed I had a cracked rib, but I refused a doctor's paper.

Tom

Our system iun the U.S. leaves a lot to be desired - especially the affordability aspect.  However,  the abuses, mis-uses and flawed UK systems (Health and Welfare) are something else...

BT

Yes, the system is flawed in the U.K. and you hear good stories and bad.  The bad - my sister-in-law fell over while on holiday in France.  She bruised both arms, went to the doctor's when she got home, got pain pills.  Three weeks later her arms are still bruised and when she returns to the doctor's she finds out both arms are broken.  There has never been an investigation as to why a 58 year old woman might break both arms just by tripping up.  Forget bone density tests, x-rays, etc.  That sort of diagnosis is less likely to happen here in the U.S. where we test everything over and over again.
On the good side, my father in the U.K. has stage 4 stomach cancer.  He is 82 and was extremely fit.  Right now he is doing quite well.  He opted against chemotherapy, preferring quality of life to longevity.  I assumed because of his age he'd be pushed to one side and forgotten.  Not so.  He has received outstanding care, receives blood transfusions when he needs them, sees an oncologist and dietician regularly and gets visits from these wonderful McMillan nurses who take care of medication, questions and so on.  Absolutely outstanding.  His care has been far better than I could ever have imagined.  It has really made me appreciate the NHS where at least people don't have to make a decision about whether they are going to buy medicine or food, and they don't wind up bankrupted by medical bills.

Christine

Thanks for the story Christine. It's tough being thousands of miles away from family, especially when they get older and/or have medical problems.

Chris, yes despite the downsides, I would rather be  in need of 'age related' healthcare in the UK than in the US.    In general, the UK  system certainly does have more facilities and provide far better services for the elderly.  My mother-in-law was admitted to a superb UK healthcare facility in her final months (at no cost)  and could not have been treated with more dignity or kindness.

BT

My feeling is that you stand a better chance of getting a fast and accurate diagnosis in this country as the doctors are more prone to do tests immediately and it seems slow sometimes to even get an x-ray in Britain, but as far as post-diagnosis care and attention, it is better in the U.K.  You are treated with dignity.  I hope that doesn't change.  Nice to have doctors who want to help people as opposed to those who may want to help people but also want to make huge amounts of money.  And it's nice that treatment in the U.K. is free.  That's an incredible benefit.  Freedom from worry about medical bills too. 

Thanks for the kind words, Tom.  Yes, it's a bummer being over here when my Dad is ill.  When I came over here my Dad was only 48 and this moment never entered my head except in only the most distant terms.  Heck, I even had three grandparents alive when I emigrated.  I'm headed over there again in three weeks.  I'm going to try flashing my U.K. passport as you do (mentioned in another string).  Hope the rozzers don't get me!

Christine

When I came over here ... this moment never entered my head except in only the most distant terms.

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Same here Christine. Both my parents have since passed, as have several other family members. We have few remaining elderly family in the UK - I have a (much older) sister living in the UK and Chris (my other half) has a Dad over there. Numerous family members on both sides made countless trips to California, bur Chris' Dad is no longer allowed to travel due to a heart problem.

I'm headed over there again in three weeks.  I'm going to try flashing my U.K. passport as you do (mentioned in another string).  Hope the rozzers don't get me!

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Have a great trip. The rozzers won't be a problem, and hopefully you'll have no issue re-entering the U.S. Just don't produce two passports at the same time. I've always been prepared for the question which was never asked. But, if it was, I'd just tell the truth - it's easier and quicker to get through Heathrow. One could, I suppose, say that they must have forgotten to stamp it, but I prefer to tell the truth.

Tom,
Do you leave the U.S. on your American passport?  I am a little concerned they scan it these days and must have a record of when you leave and when you return.
Christine

Christine,

Unlike when we leave Heathrow, I've never gone through any kind of passport control when leaving the U.S. Just check in at the airline desk, go through security, walk to the gate, and hit the friendly skies.

OTOH if they did scan or stamp my (U.S.) passport on leaving the U.S., it wouldn't change my procedure at Heathrow or when arriving back in the U.S.

Tom,
Thanks.  That makes sense.  Guess I didn't think it through properly.  I'll give it a try.
Christine

Which part of the UK Christine?

Don't forget to take your wellies, raincoat and umbrella. I hear it's been raining for the last 10 weeks, and they're forecasting little/no change through autumn and winter. We used to joke that it rains 366 days a year in not-so-sunny South Wales. My neighbor, a Dutchman, jokes that it rains 9 days a week in Holland.

Tom,  I can't imagine 10 weeks of rain with more predicted.  No offense, but I'd go stark raving crazy.  ;D  Is there a high incidence of depression in the UK?

We've been here in Bodega Bay with fog and cloud cover for four days.  This morning we awoke to bright sunshine and my spirits lifted immediately.  Guess I've been in Sunny California too long.

Marsha~

Marsha,

We arrived in California on July 2 and, on July 3, I did what I'd always done when getting out of bed - I peeked behind the drapes to see what the weather was like. Oh, the sun is shining. July 4 did the same thing, again on July 5. After several weeks I deduced that the sun shines a lot more frequently in CA than in Wales  ;D

Sunshine definitely has a different impact on one's mood than rain.

You've been unlucky with that marine layer hugging the coast for several days.

Tom,
I was born and raised in Middlesbrough, North Yorkshire.  My parents now live in a very pretty village close to there and the North York Moors.  Ducks in the stream, two village greens, pub on the green and so on.  I've lived for the last 18 months in northern Alabama.  Plenty of sun, plenty of rain.  When I first came to this country I used to carry an umbrella everywhere.  Just like in England where you carried an umbrella to work as it could be raining when you came home.  Didn't take long to get rid of that habit!
Christine

Ah, James Herriot country. Must make you really homesick when you visit.

Just like in England where you carried an umbrella to work as it could be raining when you came home.  Didn't take long to get rid of that habit!

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When folks in CA discover umrellas in our cars and ask "what's this for?", my standard reply is - the way you can tell someone is from the UK is by the number of umbrellas in their car  ;D

I'll bet that in Wales the moss grows on all sides of the trees, not just on the North side.  ;D

LOL Carson. Some time ago someone sent me this photo of a bar in Wales, open during a flood. The locals obviously took to it like ducks to water.