Have quite a list - focusing on power converter at the moment

[MGH1]

As I mentioned in my first intro post, we purchased our 2000 Bounder about a month ago. It runs and drives great, but there are several other components that need some work. I've done what I can, hoping some would be a simple swap, but now I'm starting to struggle. I'll dive right in to the list.

Rooftop A/Cs

• Have power, and fans blow, but compressor never kicks on.
• Same symptoms before purchasing. Upon closer inspection, everything was completely rusted/corroded. I replaced with new Coleman Mach 3 units. Old units were Coleman as well, look almost exactly the same.
• RV has a 30A electrical panel.
• Have only tried running them plugged into a garage outlet, 20A 125V. Only trying to run one at a time.
• A/C units are managed by the "Electronic Climate Control Energy Management Unit Master Controller".
• Each A/C has it's own control box. One picture attached shows what they look like. They aren't the freshest looking things, but I did open them up and don't see any obvious issues on the boards inside. They're left hanging for now as they have to mount up inside the A/C unit itself.
• Based on donn's reply to my intro post (and a co-worker as well), sounds like I need to get to a 30A service and try there before too much else.

Onan Marquis 5500 Generator

• Pretty sure it hadn't been run in years before I got it.
• I changed the oil and filter before anything else.
• Tries to start fine, sometimes dies right away. Sometimes runs for a few minutes, then dies.
• A couple YouTube videos suggested draining some oil to leave it just a little over the "Add" mark. I did this, but it still starts and dies as above.

GFCI Outlet

• There is one 120V circuit that starts with a GFCI outlet in the galley.
• I've removed the outlet, confirmed power coming in, but when installed, it does not supply power at the outlet, nor downstream outlets on the circuit.
• There's a green light on the outlet that is illuminated.
• The test and reset buttons do not seem to work.
• All of the above was exactly the same with the outlet that was there when we purchased the RV. I installed a new GFCI outlet, and have the same symptoms.
• Does this mean I have a ground short somewhere in this circuit, and "just" need to find and correct it?

AC to DC Power Converter

• The coach batteries are charged fine from the chassis motor when the engine is running. I think they are charged by the generator, though it's tough to tell with the generator issues mentioned above. The coach batteries are NOT charged from shore power (garage power, 20A 125V).
• Coach batteries are two 6V units connected in series. They do power the 12V system (lights and fans) when charged.
• The RV came with an Intelli Power PD9260C converter installed. After figuring out it wasn't actually charging the coach batteries, I discovered that the three 20A fuses of the unit were all blown. I replaced these fuses. The Remote Pendant light came on, but it still wasn't charging the coach batteries.
• I could detect DC voltage at the converter, but it seems it's just whatever voltage the batteries are currently supplying, whether it's 11.4V or after draining for a bit, down to ~7V.
• I confirmed the outlet the converter is plugged into is supplying voltage (118.9V).
• The RV came with another converter, an Intelli Power PD9155. This was in a closet, sitting in the open box of the 9200 series converter. I assumed the 9260 was installed to replace the 9155, so assumed the 9155 was a bad unit.
• However, after finding the 9260 wasn't working, I bench tested the 9155 and it seems to run fine. It puts out 13.8V when plugged in on the bench.
• I swapped in the 9155, but still get no charging of the coach batteries.
• I disconnected the DC wires from the 9155, plugged it back into the same 120V outlet which provides power to the converter in the RV, and it still puts out 13.8V.
• After reconnecting the DC wires to the converter, I again cannot detect voltage coming from the converter.
• Could there be something in the RV systems which prevent the converter(s) from supplying power when they seem to work fine on the bench?

That's a lot. And there's probably more I just haven't gotten to yet. While I wish there wasn't so much to troubleshoot with our first RV, I'm clinging to the silver lining of learning a lot right away, and being that much more confident when we do go out. However many kind souls there are out there who can share their experience, I appreciate you!

Thanks,
- Matt

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Does this mean I have a ground short somewhere in this circuit, and "just" need to find and correct it?

Almost assuredly. The GFCI circuit in the outlet has detected a fault and shut off power to the receptacle and anything downstream. What do the outlet instructions say about the green light? It obviously means something...

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Could there be something in the RV systems which prevent the converter(s) from supplying power when they seem to work fine on the bench?

What is between the converter and the batteries? A disconnect relay, perhaps?

Here's a link to the PD 9260 Troubleshooter: Troubleshooting Guides from Progressive Dynamics

 

[Rene T]

Too much in this post, at least for me, to digest. Can you pick just one issue, start a post and we’ll focus on that one item and try to help you. Then we can move on to your next issue.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Tries to start fine, sometimes dies right away. Sometimes runs for a few minutes, then dies.

A 2001 vintage Onan Marquis should have internal diagnostics and show a code that indicates why it stopped. Some codes are very precise, others just general info. The Onan owner manual will show how to read codes and their meaning. Info is available online if you don't have the manual. Onan also has a free Generator Handbook that includes a lot of general use info on all their generators.

 

[Kirk]

Almost assuredly. The GFCI circuit in the outlet has detected a fault and shut off power to the receptacle and anything downstream.

I would agree with this if the GFCI is working and also wired properly.

Can you pick just one issue, start a post and we’ll focus on that one item and try to help you.

As a career electromechanical service tech I not only agree with this thought but I also suggest that you choose one problem to resolve and concentrate on it along until resolved. It has been my experience that it can be very difficult to troubleshoot multiple problems at the same time unless they are simple ones. After you choose one problem, make notes of each step that you take and of the results of each test made or measurement taken. Doing so will not only help you to keep things in prospective but it will enable you to share with people here accurately and so enable us to be of more help.

 

[John From Detroit]

On the geneator When it dies read the error code (Flashing indicator light)
Saw one once that flashed "Batteries low or cranking speed too slow" Well we know it started and ran.. but only so long as you held the button.. Turns out it was not outputting 120vac (Brushes/slip rings not playing nice).
On the PD9260 (Good unit by the way) the blown fuses are kind of alarming.. I"m guessing someone did a battery reverse install cause that's about the only thing that will pop those.
There may have been additional damage... Progressive Dynamics is in Marshal Michigan (Been there got a new 9180 when my 9180 failed. Re-used the charge wizard).

If it's less than 10 years they will take the old one in trade or so I have heard.

 

[MGH1]

Almost assuredly. The GFCI circuit in the outlet has detected a fault and shut off power to the receptacle and anything downstream. What do the outlet instructions say about the green light? It obviously means something...

I would agree with this if the GFCI is working and also wired properly.

According to the attached, the green light actually means everything is fine.

I had an electrician friend take a quick look. Aside from agreeing that something downstream may be triggering a ground fault, he suggested one possible next step of troubleshooting would be to remove the GFCI outlet altogether, bypass it by connecting the in and out blacks together, and in and out whites together, then turning the main circuit back on - the idea being that the breaker for this circuit should then trip if there is a ground fault. Would you guys concur with that as a next step to troubleshoot?

 

[MGH1]

What is between the converter and the batteries? A disconnect relay, perhaps?

Here's a link to the PD 9260 Troubleshooter: Troubleshooting Guides from Progressive Dynamics

I took a look at the troubleshooter and the video they have posted. It's pretty much the same as the troubleshooting that's in the user manual. I think I've confirmed all the simple stuff.

One thing the mention, but can't get into much detail about is having too much electrical load. I'm not running anything (intentionally) but wonder if there might be something causing an unintentional load?

The RV does have separate disconnect relays for the chassis and coach batteries. They seem to work normally. I've already had a couple "ah crap" moments before realizing/remembering that they were off. Have you seen these relays causing issues before?

 

[MGH1]

A 2001 vintage Onan Marquis should have internal diagnostics and show a code that indicates why it stopped.

On the geneator When it dies read the error code (Flashing indicator light)

Thanks. I don't see any codes or lights on my model though. Here's a picture of mine. Am I just looking at it cross-eyed?

 

[MGH1]

Too much in this post, at least for me, to digest. Can you pick just one issue, start a post and we’ll focus on that one item and try to help you. Then we can move on to your next issue.

I also suggest that you choose one problem to resolve and concentrate on it along until resolved.

Dually noted, and I thought that might be the sentiment. If members would like to focus only on the power converter, I'd be grateful for that. I decided to put it all here in case anyone thought issues might be related. Was actually trying to prevent a bunch of back and forth with someone eventually saying "Why didn't you mention that before?!".

If/when I think I need more help elsewhere I'll make it a different post. Thanks again.

 

[John From Detroit]

Thanks. I don't see any codes or lights on my model though. Here's a picture of mine. Am I just looking at it cross-eyed?

The light should be in the START/STOP switch.
Pressing STOP until you hear the fuel pump start (Gas models) should cause the light to come one
As you crank it will "Flicker" (Voltage drop during compression cycles)
Once it's running light should come on steady
And when it dies it should blink.
As I recall tapping the stop button should cause it to repeat the blink cycle.
Count the flashes. like 3.4.2 3.4.2 or whatever And post

 

[Old_Crow]

The 5500 that came with my '00 coach was the same as yours, with no lights in the switch. The 7000 that I installed when the 5500 died also doesn't have lights in the switch. The switches are just rubber covered rocker switches. Not sure what year they started using the switches with lights in the 5500/7000 series Onans.

 

[MGH1]

The 5500 that came with my '00 coach was the same as yours, with no lights in the switch.... The switches are just rubber covered rocker switches.

Thank you for that! I was wondering if I was crazy or clueless. You're remembering exactly what I have here. I just read through my GenSet manual again too. There's nothing there about codes or how to read them.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Usually the remote switch has the indicator light but the one on the genset itself may not. Apparently your Marquis pre-dates the introduction of the electronic controls with self-diagnosis. Sorry if I confused you with my previous reply about the fault codes.

 

[MGH1]

General update here. I finally got to a 30A circuit (for the first time). Each rooftop A/C blows cold, and seems to operate normally.

I'm still focusing on the generator. My next step there will be replacing the oil pressure switch.

 

[Reinigm]

Thanks. I don't see any codes or lights on my model though. Here's a picture of mine. Am I just looking at it cross-eyed?

Another thing it might be. When I bought my RV, the generator had not been run for a while. The fuel circuit was gummed up. I took the fuel line loose at the carburetor and fed some Seafoam into it. I also put a couple cans of Seafoam in the gas tank. Let it sit a couple of days to penetrate and clean out the circuit. Then I tried starting it. Took a bit but started up. It was loping and running pretty bad for a while, but I kept treating it with the Seafoam. Took about a month but finally the Genny smoothed out. After that I made a point of driving down to the beach once a week and exercised it for about an hour. Still do that and it is still running very smoothly. The one hour I also run and exercise the AC, and then I run the Microwave to cook something. Might as well make sure everything works at the same time, right?

 

[8Muddypaws]

My first though regarding the generator was 'Carburator', then 'fuel filter'.

Varnish from old gas builds up in carburetor jets and passages. Also in the float bowl.

Seafoam 'may' help. If not a carb rebuild or new carb might be needed.

I had one of those years ago. A very finicky genset. I remember spending weeks trying to troubleshoot mine and finally discovering it was the main control board all along. The board was way cheaper than all the parts I replaced.

When you do get it running remember to exercise it under load monthly.

 

[MGH1]

Thanks guys. You're both thinking fuel system. And of course, yes, that could be where it is.

The reason I'm not thinking fuel system at the moment is this: When started cold, it'll start reasonably well (maybe take 2-3 tries), and then run for a couple minutes before shutting down on its own. While running, it's steady and does produce A/C power (though possibly not as steady as A/C power should be, as mentioned by Gary). Main point: upon restarting now that it's warm, it'll only run for 10-15 seconds, then when restarted again and again, not run at all if not holding down the start switch.

Cold start or warm, I started it with the fuel line pulled off the filter to verify the fuel pump was sending fuel in either case. It does. I realize this is upstream of the filter and carb, so does not entirely rule out a fuel issue. Still taking baby steps.

Thanks as always.

 

[CharlesinGA]

The generator itself DOES NOT charge the house batteries. It will however, power the converter, which does charge the batteries.

Power converter.................. You know the 9155 works and it appears to have a Charge Wizard with it so that will provide multi-stage charging like the 9260 (which has the charge wizard built in to it)

Did you check the fuses on the output of the converter? all three of them are in parallel but they will blow if a battery is hooked up backwards. Replace the fuses and see if the converter puts out.

Manual for the PD91XX/92XX series

Troubleshooting guide for 91XX/92XX converters.

Youtube video on Progressive Dynamics - Converter Diagnosis