Honda Generators

[jwilson66]

Also have 2 EU2000s.? I understand you can buy a 6 gal marine gas tank, and hook fuel lines from both generators to it, and the generators will siphon fuel when they are running.? I have no problem getting the fuel tank, but am unsure of the fittings and how to set up the fuel delivery lines.? Anyone out there doing this?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?John

Got lots of info - thanks.  For Tom Clark, Sealy, Tx:

In your jury-rigged connector outfit, when you said that you adjusted the tank vent-hole so that the tubing fit snugly "over it" for a vapor barrier, you meant "fit snugly into it", didn't you?  And if it is too snug, will it stop siphoning if the negative pressure in the tank gets too much?                              jwilson66

 

[BruceinFL]

Also have 2 EU2000s.  I understand you can buy a 6 gal marine gas tank, and hook fuel lines from both generators to it, and the generators will siphon fuel when they are running.  I have no problem getting the fuel tank, but am unsure of the fittings and how to set up the fuel delivery lines.  Anyone out there doing this?                    John

Got lots of info - thanks.  For Tom Clark, Sealy, Tx:

In your jury-rigged connector outfit, when you said that you adjusted the tank vent-hole so that the tubing fit snugly "over it" for a vapor barrier, you meant "fit snugly into it", didn't you?  And if it is too snug, will it stop siphoning if the negative pressure in the tank gets too much?                              jwilson66

For all kinds of info on Honda gens, check out the Honda Gen forum at Honda Forum. Look at the links and the photo albums for parallel rigs and fuel tank rigs. Check out this website for do-it-yourself fuel connectors and kits: Duration Power

 

[bmturp]

I am a new member and this is my first post, so be patient and kind until I learn the secrets.  I hope this gets through.

Yes, I am presently using two Honda EUI 2000 inverters and connecting them to a boat tank for fuel.  It works great, except the Honda's do not have enough "suck" to maintain fuel flow with the tank at the same level as the generator.  The tank has to be higher for a gravity flow.  I found two three gallon tanks at a marine supply store with Honda outboard snap couplers for $25 ea.  I drilled out the vent hole to accept the 1/4 inch fitting and just snap to it.  Still one problem, the tank will not vent without loosening the gas cap if I am not using the boat tank, but that is very seldom.

You might also find interesting, instead of the commercial Honda lash up for connecting and synching both generators which sells for $269, I made mine for $22 and it works great.  Powers the entire trailer including air conditioning and maintains 122 volts.  It kept my fiver at    78 deg while it was 108 outside.  The generators paid for themselves on that trip.

 

[dontro]

  Interesting about the $22 connector/synch for the two Honda generators.  I have an EU 2000i and am thinking about getting another one.  I'll be glad to invest $22 to make a connector/synch for myself.  What exactly did you do?

 

[bmturp]

There is no magic in the purchased units and I cannot understand where they come up with the $260+ dollars they get unless it is for liability.  They connect the unit to the front mounted shielded banana plug jacks which bypasses the internal circuit breakers and then rely on the circuit breaker of the coach that plugs into it.  I would think if something happened to the power cord prior to the coach it would undoubtedly destroy one or both generators with a direct short.

Instead of the banana plug connection, I simply used two quality 110 v grounded plugs and connected them to the back side of a standard 30 amp receptacle then mounted it in a plastic utility box with a cover.  I had the cables from a 30 amp extension cord that I used one end of earlier, but everything else was purchased at LOWE'S for around $22.  By using the duplex plugs, each output is routed through the Honda internal 20 amp circuit breaker.  For reasons I cannot understand, the banana plug jacks bypass these circuit breakers.  The shielded banana plugs can be purchased on the internet for not a lot of money and someday I may change to them, but for now I like the idea of having the circuit breakers in the line. 

One VERY IMPORTANT thing is that if one 110 v plug comes out of either HONDA, it will be live 110 volts from the other generator across the exposed ends.  Dangerous, yes, but I have never had a plug pull or get kicked out of a generator yet.  If you have little children running around this might not be the solution for you. But if somebody gets zapped while trying to steal one of the Hondas, damn that's tragic!

I have used the connector several times and it works flawlessly, and both EU2000Is run my entire trailer including the airconditioner.  Something I am going to try and incorporate in my little plastic box is an amp meter to monitor the exact amperage draw of the coach.  I think that informnation would assist me in knowing that I should not turn on something else with out first turning off something because I am approaching the 13.3 amps per generator safe level.

 

[Tom]

One VERY IMPORTANT thing is that if one 110 v plug comes out of either HONDA, it will be live 110 volts from the other generator across the exposed ends.

Just curious - is that also true of the Honda jumper setup? (I haven't seen or used one).

 

[bmturp]

NO.  That is why they use th3e shieleded banana plug.  The shielding has no esxposeed prongs to make cfontactd with.

 

[Tom]

OK thanks.

 

[Karl]

For reasons I cannot understand, the banana plug jacks bypass these circuit breakers.

Because circuit breakers are not all equal, a heavy load may cause one to always trip before the other, preventing you from getting the full 4kw power capacity. By bypassing the c.b.'s, the load is equally shared and power shutdown is handled by the inverter controller when an overload/overheat/short circuit condition is detected.

 

[bmturp]

Because circuit breakers are not all equal, a heavy load may cause one to always trip before the other, preventing you from getting the full 4kw power capacity. By bypassing the c.b.'s, the load is equally shared and power shutdown is handled by the inverter controller when an overload/overheat/short circuit condition is detected.

If this is true, why have CBs in the circuit at all?  (Sorry I'm late but been gone for a week.)

 

[King]

It sounds like what he is doing is connecting a generator to one terminal of a 30 a female connector and the other to the other terminal and tying their commons together.  That way, if his RV has no 240 v appliances, there is no need to synchronize the generators, since the power is distributed separately in the rv.  I would advise never to connect the output of two generators together without the manufacturers synchronizing system.
Art

 

[Karl]

If this is true, why have CBs in the circuit at all?

In fact, the Honda EU1000 doesn't even have a circuit breaker, but relies on the overload detection circuit of the inverter to shut off power. The EU2000 and EU3000 do have circuit breakers to prevent each units' paralleled receptacles from drawing too much. The paralleling (synchronizing) system does not mean you can draw double the amperage from any one or two receptacles on the same genset with both gensets running; you're still limited by the 20A c.b that protects each unit.

Art,

It sounds like what he is doing is connecting a generator to one terminal of a 30 a female connector and the other to the other terminal and tying their commons together.  That way, if his RV has no 240 v appliances, there is no need to synchronize the generators, since the power is distributed separately in the rv.

By synchronizing the two units, you can wire one receptacle from one unit to one receptacle of the other unit and be reasonably sure of having double the power available thru a single 30A (external) receptacle. Load splitting only comes into play if your rv is wired for 50A service and you have 240V available at the post. There's no way you can get 240V from paralleled Honda gensets; they would have to be connected in series and have their outputs 180 degrees out of phase. To power a 50 A wired rig, my choice would be to parallel the outputs (for higher current draw), then run the single paralleled 'hot' to both of the 'hot' connectors on the 50A receptacle. That way it wouldn't matter as much if there were unbalanced loads (30A on one; 10A on the other) on the 2 sides of the rv's breaker box. As an alternative, if you know your loads ARE balanced, don't synchronize them, but simply wire one genset to one 'hot', and the other genset to the other 'hot'. That would be helpful if, say, you have the majority of stuff on one side, and an a/c unit on the other. Then you'd be able to use the second genset only when you need to run the a/c. You may have to do some re-wiring inside the breaker box to achieve this, but you woldn't have to shut down all loads before cranking up the second genset, as you would if they were wired for synchronization.

 

[King]

Sorry, I was confusing 30a with 50a.  I still don,t think you can connect two generator outputs together unless you have the manufacturer's synchronizing system.
Art

 

[Karl]

Art,

The sync system is no more than 2 proper gauge wires connecting the 2 'special' outlets (bypassing the c.b.'s) on each unit. Just like jumpering two batteries. I don't even think you have to go 'left to left' and 'right to right', as the inverter figures out the phase relationship. The key is that you must make your connections and start both units before putting on any load. The reason for bypassing the c.b.'s is so it will maintain synchronization even if one of the loads pops a c.b.       

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

I still don,t think you can connect two generator outputs together unless you have the manufacturer's synchronizing system.

Generally true, I think, but apparently not the case for the Honda inverter models (eu1000i & eu2000i). Apparently they are self-synchronizing.

 

[King]

Wow...  Will wonders never cease.    Awesome technology advance.
Art

 

[Lowell]

I learned some things about generator noise at Quartzsite.  I had always heard the Honda generators are very quiet and I agree.  I also listened to  Kipor and Yamaha generators running under load at the RV show and they were quiet too.  What totally surprised me was the noise made by the generators running in the motor homes.  They are much louder than any of the others. 

So I'm  rethinking why I would want to spend all that money for a quiet generator when all I going to be hearing is the noise from the motor home generator next to me in a campground? ??? ???  I might as well buy a 3500 watt generator at Costco and make a little noise of my own.

 

[Karl]

Lowell,

I know what you're saying, but remember that most of the built-in generators in motor homes are in the range of 4 to 15kW, and can't be expected to be as quiet as a little Honda 1000 or 2000. That said, many of the newer 7 or 8kW or larger generators, especially diesels, are as quiet as them

I might as well buy a 3500 watt generator at Costco and make a little noise of my own.

I know you were saying that partly in jest, but us old foggies value our quiet conversations around a campfire, and Costco, Home Depot, Menards, et al, sell them mostly to contractors; not rv'ers. Those gensets are not rv-friendly, and some folks will let you know that in no uncertain terms ;D

I also listened to  Kipor and Yamaha generators running under load at the RV show and they were quiet too.  What totally surprised me was the noise made by the generators running in the motor homes.

I think you'll agree that listening to a generator at an rv show with all the people milling about and vendors hawking their wares, is quite different from listening to the same generator in the solitude of the desert. What seems quiet there may not seem so quiet once you get it home, away from the din of the crowd.

 

[Lowell]

Karl, I didn't realize some of those motor home generators were so large.  Sure, a 15 KW generator will make more noise than a 3KW.  Maybe I shouldn't have been so surprised.  But to tell the truth, I really was!  I was glad to see 10 PM generator curfew come along so they would be shut down.  I walked the line of RVs in the evening before 10 PM listening and I was impressed by one Honda 3000 mounted on the front of a 5th wheel.  It was a very acceptable level of noise.  I guess the lesson I should take from this is that if I'm going to boondock, I need to do it away from a group.  We almost always try to find a campground with water and electric anyway, so this isn't likely to be a big problem for us. 

But I am tempted to find a cheap generator to run during the day to recharge my batteries on the TT.  Both nights in Quartzsite, with a fresh battery each night, my voltage dropped enough that my low voltage warning light came on and shut down the furnace about 5 in the morning. That surprised me too.  With my old pop-up, I could go several nights of furnace running on just one battery.  The TT must use a lot more juice for some of the other things I didn't have in the 89 pop-up.

 

[Ned]

We're in QZ right now, running our 7.5KW Onan Quiet Diesel generator that actually sounds louder inside than out, and 4 of us are carrying on conversations with no problem.  I doubt that Karl, about 20' away, can even hear our generator.