I would like to hear from owners of 5th wheel campers that are using a half ton pick-up to tow it. Any problems? Any issues? Any regrets? If you could also tell me me what truck you have and what the dry weight of your trailer is I would appreciate it very much. Thanks!
Need to hear from 5th wheel owners using a half ton pick-up
- Thread starter Joekool
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grashley
Well-known member
Welcome to the Forum!
Tow a FW with a ? ton truck? MAJOR PROBLEMS!!!! Here is why.
First, I tow a FW with dry wt of 12,000# and GVWR of 15,000#. I tow with a F350 one ton truck.
To start, look at the driver door latch pillar of the truck for a yellow border placard which states the maximum weight of cargo and passengers shall not exceed xxxx lbs. That is the payload for YOUR truck as it left the assembly plant. The number is probably between 1200 and 1800 lbs. More options, lower number. Bigger cab, 4X4, lower number.
Note this limit includes ALL passengers, ALL cargo in the truck, 200# for a FW hitch and the FW pin wt, which will be about 20% of the actual, loaded for travel weight of the FW.
Unless you are towing the EMPTY FW home, the dry wt is useless, but salesmen LOVE them. Nobody goes camping in an empty camper. When you are ready to enjoy the great outdoors, the actual weight will be much closer to GVWR, so use that number. If you are a few hundred pounds lighter, it is a small safety factor.
I had a friend a few years ago who had a new Chevy ? ton Reg cab, 2WD, few options. This dealer also sold campers, and he told me they had a FW for sale he could easily tow. It was only 7500# dry wt. I called his bluff. First, that camper, ready to camp would weigh at least 8500#, probably more. That is 1700# pin wt. Add a 200# FW hitch, makes 1900#. Then I opened the driver door, and his max payload was 1835#. He was overweight BEFORE he or his wife got in the truck!
Full disclosure: It IS possible to tow a FW with a ? ton, and there is one member here doing it. First, the truck is a F150 with the Heavy Payload Package, tow package, high rear end ratio, and 18" tires - all required for max payload. I believe it is a reg cab 2WD. It has few options. If I recall, he had to special order the truck. Second, he has a SMALL FW.
PLEASE be safe! Get a 1 ton truck to safely pull a reasonable size FW
Tow a FW with a ? ton truck? MAJOR PROBLEMS!!!! Here is why.
First, I tow a FW with dry wt of 12,000# and GVWR of 15,000#. I tow with a F350 one ton truck.
To start, look at the driver door latch pillar of the truck for a yellow border placard which states the maximum weight of cargo and passengers shall not exceed xxxx lbs. That is the payload for YOUR truck as it left the assembly plant. The number is probably between 1200 and 1800 lbs. More options, lower number. Bigger cab, 4X4, lower number.
Note this limit includes ALL passengers, ALL cargo in the truck, 200# for a FW hitch and the FW pin wt, which will be about 20% of the actual, loaded for travel weight of the FW.
Unless you are towing the EMPTY FW home, the dry wt is useless, but salesmen LOVE them. Nobody goes camping in an empty camper. When you are ready to enjoy the great outdoors, the actual weight will be much closer to GVWR, so use that number. If you are a few hundred pounds lighter, it is a small safety factor.
I had a friend a few years ago who had a new Chevy ? ton Reg cab, 2WD, few options. This dealer also sold campers, and he told me they had a FW for sale he could easily tow. It was only 7500# dry wt. I called his bluff. First, that camper, ready to camp would weigh at least 8500#, probably more. That is 1700# pin wt. Add a 200# FW hitch, makes 1900#. Then I opened the driver door, and his max payload was 1835#. He was overweight BEFORE he or his wife got in the truck!
Full disclosure: It IS possible to tow a FW with a ? ton, and there is one member here doing it. First, the truck is a F150 with the Heavy Payload Package, tow package, high rear end ratio, and 18" tires - all required for max payload. I believe it is a reg cab 2WD. It has few options. If I recall, he had to special order the truck. Second, he has a SMALL FW.
PLEASE be safe! Get a 1 ton truck to safely pull a reasonable size FW
Roy M
Well-known member
I tried it, won't do that again. It had barely enough power going up the grade, the temp gauge was in the red, and the descent off the pass was breathtaking to say the least! My current 2500 ctd is more than adequate for the current fw that grosses at 5600# and I like it that way.
IBTripping
Well-known member
What are you guys talking about. Towing a 5th wheel with a 1/2 ton pickup is easy.
Just as long as you only tow it on flat land and never up or down hills and slowly. :
Just as long as you only tow it on flat land and never up or down hills and slowly. :
Gizmo100
Well-known member
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2018
- Posts
- 3,065
IBTripping said:What are you guys talking about. Towing a 5th wheel with a 1/2 ton pickup is easy.
Just as long as you only tow it on flat land and never up or down hills and slowly. :
You forgot to mention.....Not to plan on any quick stops ;D ;D
There are a few on this site that tow a 5th with a 1/2 ton. They have a very special good towing packaged 1/2 ton, and a unusual light, smaller, 5th wheel. Do NOT attempt if you are not very educated on trucks, trailers, towing, etc. Problems is an understatement, issues is an understatement, regrets, well, not if you really want a new truck in the first place, and Dry Weight, useless.Joekool said:
Welcome to the forum, 1/2 ton trucks and 5th wheel do not belong in the same sentence. It usually is a stretch going 25' travel trailer with most 1/2 tons.
Great Horned Owl
Well-known member
There is one 5th wheel that can be safely towed with a 1/2 ton truck.
https://www.scamptrailers.com/showroom/19-deluxe-trailers.html?id=41
Joel
https://www.scamptrailers.com/showroom/19-deluxe-trailers.html?id=41
Joel
UTTransplant
Well-known member
Please note that if you go to a dealer and ask them if your truck can tow a specific fifth wheel, they will tell you ?of course,? and talk about tow capacity. What they do not tell you is the important parameter is bed weight. I had a guy parked next to us a few weeks ago who had a 35? fifth wheel and a Ford 150. He said how terribly it towed, and I very gently tried to discuss bed payload. He used the ?but the salesman told me it only weighed 10,000 pounds, and my truck can pull 10,000 pounds?. BTW, he said his plan was to buy a 40? and a F250. I don?t think that will make the situation any better.
steveblonde
Well-known member
is it possible - in a word YES - is it advisable - probably not . Most 1/2 ton have a cargo cap about 1400 lbs +/- buy the time you add 2 adults the hitch (200lbs) the pin weight of the 5er 1200-3000lbs you can see how you run out of capacity real quick
and NO adding air bags doesnt not change the capacity of the truck - period
the other issue is most often 1/2 tons come with a 5.5 box which is way too short for any 5er
and NO adding air bags doesnt not change the capacity of the truck - period
the other issue is most often 1/2 tons come with a 5.5 box which is way too short for any 5er
Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
There are only a very few 5W's that can be safely towed by half ton trucks. With a 5W, the truck has to carry 20-25% of the trailer weight on the hitch (in the truck bed). Due to the limited payload of almost every half-ton, the size of the 5W will be extremely limited. It's possible to configure a half ton with more payload than typical (1000 lbs or so), but none of them will be large. 1400 lbs is a lot for a half ton and that isn't much to cover the passengers & hitch weight as well as the 5W pin weight.
You asked about dry weight, but that's starting down the road to disaster. You aren't towing it dry unless you are making deliveries from factory to dealers. Always use the trailer GVWR as the estimated weight, both for figuring pin weight and max tow capability.
Last, many modern half tons are crew cab models with ultra-short beds (5.5 ft). That simply isn't long enough to allow most 5Ws to turn with hitting the cab. At least a 6.5 ft bed is needed.
You asked about dry weight, but that's starting down the road to disaster. You aren't towing it dry unless you are making deliveries from factory to dealers. Always use the trailer GVWR as the estimated weight, both for figuring pin weight and max tow capability.
Last, many modern half tons are crew cab models with ultra-short beds (5.5 ft). That simply isn't long enough to allow most 5Ws to turn with hitting the cab. At least a 6.5 ft bed is needed.
Don C
Well-known member
In 2007 we purchased a 1/2 ton series 5th wheel that the dealer assured us we could pull with our Silverado 1/2 half ton pickup (it had the 6.0 engine and HD trailer package). I had been pulling bumper pull trailers since 1980. Dealer was 100 miles away and when we went to pick it up, the truck it squatted so bad that we had to put air bags on the rear axle to level the truck. Advertised pin weight was around 1200 pounds. We had it weighed empty and the pin weight was over 1500 pounds. Talked with the dealer and he recommended that we always pull with fresh water tank full (fresh water tank behind the rear axle of trailer). Wife liked floor plan so we agreed. Later that year with the trailer loaded for a trip, we had the trailer weighed again and this time it pin weight was around 1700 pounds (trailer by itself weighed 9200 pounds). One season after pulling the 5th wheel with the 1/2 ton truck we had to decide to either go back to bumper pull or get a larger truck. We ended up with a 3/4 ton truck and have no regrets.
If you do decide to go with a 5th wheel, check the position of the axles on the trailer. If the center of the tandem axles to the rear of the trailer is not at least 40% of the total length of the trailer, you will have to much pin weight.
Checked out some RVs at shows this past winter and a number of them have modified pin boxes similar to the Reese sidewinder to allow them to work in 5.5' truck beds.
Check out calculator
https://www.engineersedge.com/calculators/trailer-weight-balance.htm
If you do decide to go with a 5th wheel, check the position of the axles on the trailer. If the center of the tandem axles to the rear of the trailer is not at least 40% of the total length of the trailer, you will have to much pin weight.
Checked out some RVs at shows this past winter and a number of them have modified pin boxes similar to the Reese sidewinder to allow them to work in 5.5' truck beds.
Check out calculator
https://www.engineersedge.com/calculators/trailer-weight-balance.htm
steveblonde
Well-known member
Don C said:
read the website and or the owners manual on ALL 5.5 box trucks regardless of brand and they state "not Intended to be used with a 5th wheel trailer "
IBTripping
Well-known member
Gizmo100 said:
Getting forgetful in my old age. Might be getting into Oldgator territory. ;D
Gizmo100
Well-known member
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2018
- Posts
- 3,065
IBTripping said:
We get to many olggators and I'm calling Swamp people to thin things out ;D ;D
Half ton trucks are not all the same. In fact they have the greatest variety of gvwrs/gawrs of all the LDTs.
Over the years they range from small 6k gvwr and 3200 rawr on up to 8600 gvwr and 6000 rawr depending on brands and year models.
5th wheel trailers come in various size and weights but selections in the lighter weight trailers are limited. These folks have several 5th wheel that can be pulled with a properly equipped 1/2 ton truck. https://www.allencampermfg.com/default.html I would check with other rv forums for actual users on the subject. Seems most folks bought the wrong 1/2 ton truck didn't like the tow and those that chose wisely and got the proper equipped 1/2 ton like their combo.
Of course we don't know what size/weight 5er you need so I'll list some 1/2 ton trucks and their capabilities.
GM 1500 with the NHT package gives the truck a 7600 gvwr and 4300 RAWR good for 2000+ lb payloads. It comes with the 5.3 or the 6.2 gas engines. STD duty GM trucks run in the 6900-7200 gvwr range and 3900-4000 RAWR for around 1400-1600 lb payloads.
Fords F150HDPP comes with a 7850 gvwr and 4800 rawr good for around 2400-2500 lb in the bed payloads/ Equipped with the 3.5 Ecoboost V-6 engine or the 5.0 v-8 it does a good job for its ratings.
Fords next down is a 7500 gvwr and 4500 rawr good for around 2000-2200 lb payloads.
Next down is a 7050 gvwr and 4050 rawr with around 1600-1800 lb payloads.
Ans a 6800 gvwr with small 3800 rawr and 1200-1400 lb payloads. This truck is the one many F150 owners complain about not doing the job. Its no wonder....it simply was the wrong F150 for the.
Ford uses the 3.5 EB and the 5.0 v8 for all the above trucks.
Of course actual payloads depends on actual scaled axle weights.
Ram ?? With the rear coil suspension their not the best idea for a trailer with 20-25 percent hitch weight. However many with the 5.7 hemi and 3.92 gears say pulling power is no problem.
Oh yeah..nearly forgot.
I pulled a 26' 7200 gvwr 5er with a '83 1500 chevy 4wd 5.7 4.10 gears TH350 tranny. I don't remember the trailers dry weight but it grossed around 5800-6200 lbs depending on how long we were on the road. Great memories with that combo. We ran all over the southern Rockies. The truck even towed doubles with a 2300 lb fishin boat behind the 5th wheel trailer mostly here in our part of the state with lots of large COE lakes.
Over the years they range from small 6k gvwr and 3200 rawr on up to 8600 gvwr and 6000 rawr depending on brands and year models.
5th wheel trailers come in various size and weights but selections in the lighter weight trailers are limited. These folks have several 5th wheel that can be pulled with a properly equipped 1/2 ton truck. https://www.allencampermfg.com/default.html I would check with other rv forums for actual users on the subject. Seems most folks bought the wrong 1/2 ton truck didn't like the tow and those that chose wisely and got the proper equipped 1/2 ton like their combo.
Of course we don't know what size/weight 5er you need so I'll list some 1/2 ton trucks and their capabilities.
GM 1500 with the NHT package gives the truck a 7600 gvwr and 4300 RAWR good for 2000+ lb payloads. It comes with the 5.3 or the 6.2 gas engines. STD duty GM trucks run in the 6900-7200 gvwr range and 3900-4000 RAWR for around 1400-1600 lb payloads.
Fords F150HDPP comes with a 7850 gvwr and 4800 rawr good for around 2400-2500 lb in the bed payloads/ Equipped with the 3.5 Ecoboost V-6 engine or the 5.0 v-8 it does a good job for its ratings.
Fords next down is a 7500 gvwr and 4500 rawr good for around 2000-2200 lb payloads.
Next down is a 7050 gvwr and 4050 rawr with around 1600-1800 lb payloads.
Ans a 6800 gvwr with small 3800 rawr and 1200-1400 lb payloads. This truck is the one many F150 owners complain about not doing the job. Its no wonder....it simply was the wrong F150 for the.
Ford uses the 3.5 EB and the 5.0 v8 for all the above trucks.
Of course actual payloads depends on actual scaled axle weights.
Ram ?? With the rear coil suspension their not the best idea for a trailer with 20-25 percent hitch weight. However many with the 5.7 hemi and 3.92 gears say pulling power is no problem.
Oh yeah..nearly forgot.
I pulled a 26' 7200 gvwr 5er with a '83 1500 chevy 4wd 5.7 4.10 gears TH350 tranny. I don't remember the trailers dry weight but it grossed around 5800-6200 lbs depending on how long we were on the road. Great memories with that combo. We ran all over the southern Rockies. The truck even towed doubles with a 2300 lb fishin boat behind the 5th wheel trailer mostly here in our part of the state with lots of large COE lakes.
Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
That fact remains that there aren't many 5W these days that can play nicely with a truck that has less than a 2000 lb payload. Passengers and a hitch plus the 5W pin weight will eat up a 1500-1800 lb payload quickly. Even the smallest 5W on the Allen Campers website will require 1800 lbs of payload for the truck.
Techtrip
Member
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2019
- Posts
- 15
I also was investigating trading in my class C to size down to a 5th wheel for my 2018 F-150 with 2081 lbs of payload. I quickly figured out that in order to stay within the payload limits my dry pin wt before adding 20% of GVWR of the 5th wheel would have to be 800 lb range. The smallest 5th wheel I could find (other than the all fiberglass 5000 lb really small models) was the KZ Sportsmen 231RK, and even that model would max out my payload. It would appear that you would need to find a 1/2 ton truck with at least a 2500 lb payload to safely pull the so called half-ton tow-able fifth wheels. Ford makes them, but normally you will have to order them, because they usually are not just sitting on the lots.
Hanr3
Well-known member
Joekool said:
I see you got the usual don't do it BS and none of that answered your question.
I am towing a 5er with a 1/2 ton truck and have no problems, no issues, and no regrets.
F150 3.5L turbo boost engine, XLT Supercab, Standard bed (6.5'), 6,900 pound capacity with 2078 carrying capacity.
KZ 231RK 5th wheel camper. 25'4" long and has a max weigh of 7,000 pounds, empty weight of 6,000 pounds. I could carry 1,000 pounds of camping gear. My camping gear weighs 300 pounds. I got plenty of capacity and room to carry more junk.
Things I like about the truck.
Turbos- they function as engine brakes when I decelerate. I also like to hear them wind up and expel air when the load has been lifted.
Trailer sway control through the Ford integrated brake controller. IF the truck detects sway, it flashes a warning. Freaked me out the first and only time it happened. Caught me off guard. I was going down a steep hill and thing started to get a little cady whompas, I activated the trailer brakes only and took my foot off the gas peddle to bring things back in-line. Needless to say I don't go down that hill doing 70+ any more.
I also like the fact that the truck handles perfectly. I get no trailer sway while being passed and 20mpg cross winds have little effect on steering. Only time I had a white knuckle experience was previously mentioned. I feel completely confident and comfortable towing the 5er with it.
I had to add three things so I could tow the 5th wheel; a 5th wheel hitch, plus wiring harness to put the connector in the bed of the truck, towing mirrors ($280, plus 10 minutes times), and Ford Brake Controller ($100 or so, plus a 1/2hr service charge to have the dealer activate it).
Since I have the Ford integrated brake controller, I am able to use Fords trailering logistics that are integrated into the dash display. I can track the mileage on each trailer I tow, up to 10 trailers. I can configure each trailers brake settings. I can also set it to estimate fuel mileage when towing, or estimate fuel mileage when empty. It will tell me how many miles to E and be accurate.
Miles per gallon
Empty truck, interstate- 24.2 mpg. Based on a 1,000 mile round trip over a week long vacation.
Towing my 2,300 aluminum boat- 17-19mpg. I do this about every other weekend.
towing the 5th wheel- 8-11mpg, depends on head winds. Last 400 mile trip was 10.3mpg.
triple towing, camper and boat I'm closer to the 8-9mpg range.
I drive teh speed limit or a maximum of 60mph. Whichever is higher. I don't go over 60mph. I have, and my fuel mileage suffers greatly.
I do have one regreat. Not getting the 36 gallon fuel tank instead of the 22 gallon tank. I calculate my fuel range to be 200 miles before I must stop and fill up. However, those extra 14 gallons would impact my carrying capacity. So I settled on the 22 gallon tank and stop more frequently. Gives me the oportunity to strecth the legs. I've had both knees replaced and they get stiff if I sit too long.
Questions, please ask.
Hanr3
Well-known member
Techtrip said:
Sounds like the capacities of my truck. I have a payload of 2078 per the yellow sticker. My carrying capacity is 6,900. My tuck weighs 5,400 pounds fully loaded. that leaves 1,500 pounds for pin weight. How did you calculate it would max out your truck?
steveblonde
Well-known member
Hanr3 said:
That 2078lbs means people (300) hitch (200) accessories on the truck aftermarket ie box covers, tool boxes etc (200) so now that 2000 is reduced by 700 leaves 1300 for a pin weight - i dont think i have ever seen a 5er with an 1300lb pin loaded my trailer with the genny in front is over 3000lbs even a light weight from the factory doesnt include 60lbs of propane or water clothes lawnchairs etc etc etc⁰
