New to solar and just starting to read up, guidance will be appreciated!

turner661

turner661

Advanced Member
Joined
Mar 31, 2013
Posts
34
Location
Katy, Tx
Hi everybody, I'm a real newbe to all this solar stuff and really need some guidance. I eventually want to have a good quality comprehensive solar system, especially the starting foundation for now so i can build upon that. I would be willing to pay for some design services but i don't even know where to find that? I think I've pretty much decided after some reading that the Victron equipment would be some pretty good stuff to build upon. A charge controller, BMS, Transfer switch, inverter, Cerbo GX, proper wiring/fuses/breakers, at least one 12v 200Ah LiFePO4 Lithium Battery, etc. are the things I've starting looking into. My main problem is i want to have all these proper and necessary items in good wiring design diagram so i can put it together in an organized manner. My situation should not be too awful complicated - 25 ft RV with 30A service, 3500W generator, 2 x 200W panels w/ Go-Power PWN charger which will be changed to Victron MPPT (150/70)? I don't have big power requirements, mostly things like small coffee maker, small crock pot, standard electronic devices, etc. No requirement to run AC on battery/solar... Have I given enough info? Any thoughts? All guidance very welcome. I will do my best to answer any additional questions you have?
Thank you for any guidance you can give me!

By the way, backstory... We've been RV'ing for 25 years and we are on our 4th RV. Lately, big downsize from 43' 5th wheel toy hauler to the current 25' TT so lots of experience but nothing with solar systems so that's my weakness...
 
Last edited:
before considering what you need for solar install a good quality battery monitor such as a bogart engineering trimetric and learn how much power everything in your rv uses. Once you know that then you can size the battery bank properly and then you will have an idea of how much solar you need. The panels are basically just a battery charger so until you know what you really need in a battery bank tou will just be guessing on what you need in solar.

Solar is great but doesnt produce as much power as most think. My 2000w setup produces about 75amps @12v to give you an idea.

I think having someone who knows what they are doing is well worth it. It can be a diy thing but there is a lot to know, especially how to set up the design and wiring gauges to minimize voltage drops

Your suggested setup sounds ok but for best results go with the steps above. The crock pot, coffee maker, and microwave will probably be your biggest power needs.

Recommend checking out handy bob's blog at HandyBob's Blog

He is older now and some of it is dated but the guy really knows solar. The guy has some really good info about batteries, solar stuff, forums, and a lot more.
 
Hi Turner66, and yes... Merry Christmas! You are exactly who a lot of solar providers are looking for, so try to resist all those packaged options for the time being.

The first thing we always recommend is to determine what your solar goal is. Do you just want to keep your house batteries topped off while your RV is in storage, do you want to run everything in the trailer off of solar (battery) power - even on cloudy days, or something in between. Most people opt for something in between.

When someone has determined what their solar goals are, we always recommend that they install a decent battery monitor first - not a volt meter (there's a big difference.) Once it's installed, go to a local campground, or simply park your RV in your driveway and live in it for a couple of days/nights. Do everything you would normally do when camping (TV, charging phones and laptops, lights etc.) then read from the battery monitor how much power you consumed. You're trying to determine your average power consumption over a 24 hour period. That will give you a good approximation of how much solar and battery capacity you'll need to meet your goals. That's the time to start pricing solar options.

Doing the installation work yourself can save a LOT of money, but that's not always an option for everyone. Keep in mind that solar is primarily a boondocking option. Yes, it can be used to keep batteries topped off while an RV is in storage, and it can help charge house batteries while driving down the road, but when trying to replenish all the power you use when camping, things can change significantly - especially when powering things that use a relatively high amount of power.

Kev
 
Ok, so it's been mentioned more than once already that I should start with the monitoring system. I'm cool with that. Would the following Victron solution (2 components?) below be a good choice? Do I need anything else? I should mention as well that one of my goals is to have good compatibility between all devices in my system. Consider that a priority for me over saving a few bucks with substituting other 3rd party components...

Victron Energy Version 2 VE.Bus BMS Battery Management System​

and

Victron Energy SmartSolar Pluggable Control Display​

By the way, my goal is mostly things like small coffee maker, small crock pot, standard electronic devices, small refrigerator. No requirement to run AC on battery/solar... I will find the numbers on those individual devices in the next day or so. 30A service only. Currently the RV has a standard marine 100AH deep cycle Lead Acid battery that was cheap for the dealer to install at time of purchase... Already decided i'm going to go with LiFePO4 Lithium Battery regardless...

Additional note - I am in favor of oversizing various components of the system in order to modestly future proof the system to size/capacity future change needs.

Thank you and Merry Christmas!
 
Last edited:
I've done 4 solar installs on three different RVs over about 20 years. I think your plan to go with Victron equipment is a great idea. To me, their stuff is the best.

For solar install advice, I suggest Chad Heiser. His web site in loaded with install schematics that he's done. For example: Simple non-solar to Multi-panel solar. I think he can also be contacted online on the Escapees web site.

On the other hand, stay away from Handy Bob. At best his advice is out of date. Here is some of his current "common sense" advice . . . "The truth is finally hitting main stream media. I have been trying to warn people about this danger for years and I mostly get arguments. My home contains no Lithium battery powered tools."
 
I have never owned victron stuff but i understand they make a quality product. The readings i find the most useful on my bmks are that they accurately calculate soc, show how much power is being added to or being pulled out of the battery bank, and what amount of power has been removed from the bank since last full charge. The last one makes it easy to calculate how long you need full sun on your panels to get to 100% soc.

If designed properly you can always add more batteries or panels down the road.

I didnt worry about compatibility and bought more best of breed components at the time and havent had any compatibility issues. My experience with all in one or compatible gear has been that you lose a little in performance or features to gain that compatibility. Things may have changed and that may no longer be the case.

look for batteries where the manufacturer provides detailed charging specs and if you opt for an inverter/charger rather than an inverter only, one that you can program the charger to the exact battery specs.
 
zulu said:
On the other hand, stay away from Handy Bob. At best his advice is out of date. Here is some of his current "common sense" advice . . . "The truth is finally hitting main stream media. I have been trying to warn people about this danger for years and I mostly get arguments. My home contains no Lithium battery powered tools."
Click to expand...
If you read handy bobs stuff pay attention to his post dates. Lithium ion batteries were the main type at the time and they had serious explosion risk. Lithium irons are the latest and are far more stable. Handy bob is also big on recycling so it is understandable he isnt fond of luthium batteries. His info is still valuable if you factor in the dates the info was posted.
 
turner66 said:
, my goal is mostly things like small coffee maker, small crock pot, standard electronic devices, small refrigerator.
Click to expand...
These goals put you near the top end of demand. You will need both peak capacity for transient loads (coffee) and storage for persistent loads (fridge). If your expectation is solar self sufficiency you will need a ton of panels and a large margin of battery Ah. So part of your design goal is to have a grasp of what you expect it to do and design to that, not what others have done or what packages are on amazon.

Mark B.
Albuquerque, NM
 
Once I've sorted out all my needs and have well defined power requirements; and also knowing that my newest and current RV has a very basic factory stock Go-Power solar system (panels, wiring, PWM charger, cheap single deep cycle battery) and 30A shore power, is there a logical way to start stepping through upgrading/build with better components? I can envision having logical method to this but I don't know what makes the most sense. Make no mistake, I don't intend to jump ahead and skip things... I just want to have a good plan before I even start to dive in. The name of this game for me is to "do it right" more than anything... To that end, I feel fortunate to be retired with plenty of time (and adequate funding) to take this at my own pace at a good quality level. So, does anybody have nice mental picture of a logical approach that i might follow? For example, should I start with battery monitoring system for existing, then maybe Lithium battery(s), charger system, inverter, wiring, fuses, breakers, transfer switch, proper display of monitors, solar test equipment/devices to help the buildout? Thank you all kindly for anything you care to contribute to me as I learn!
Brad
 
turner66 said:
, is there a logical way to start stepping through upgrading/build with better components?
Click to expand...
The logical approach is to use your existing setup to quantify your usage. Even operation that exceeds the existing system capacity is useful data. Then get past the notion you'll buy a package and augment it. It becomes especially cost inefficient when you have to replace one or more components of a package to get it to do what you want. Know the end result up front then design to it. You can go with building the airplane in flight/incremental steps and that's OK if you don't care how well it works or how much you spend, but none of this is guesswork. If your application requires a given number of panels and Ah then anything short of that means you're running your stuff less, or your generator more. My own experience with solar is to decide up front if it's even worth the bother. Picking a sunny camping spot isn't always an option and it always comes with the consequence of the RV baking in the sun all day. That can work out OK during the winter at quartzsite or whatever but this RV'er is parking in the shade during the summer in NM. Solar can and does work and it's gratifying when your creation is net positive, but it's a long way around the block to reach that point.

Mark B.
Albuquerque, NM
 
OK, fair enough, it sounds like we are coming to some good productive common "ground"?
#1 I am starting with what is there from the new RV, I suspected monitoring this as it is would be the beginning before things got modified
#2 I have never assumed I would buy any kind of a "package". I would rather spend the money and put together the actual proper components to come out with a best and compatible solution overall. I'm not interested in modifying somebody's package to make it work. Sound good?
#3 It's "worth the bother". This will be as much enjoyment as a hobby for me as anything... I havn't been completely forthcoming only because i am not interested in sounding rude or boastful. I just retired from 35 years as an Electrical Engineer. No, I don't know "everything" and No, I am not an expert on solar by any stretch of the imagination. I fully understand the requirements phase of a big project and not to overlook. I am here to learn and be humble about it!
#4 Sun! I've lived on the west side of Houston, Tx since 1997! The sun shines basically 99.5% of the daylight hours! I have no shade. Picking a sunny spot is the only option! None of my 4 RV's over the years have ever even been stored inside in the shade! Campgrounds rarely have convenient tree shade, we're used to it. For example, this weekend we are camping at Margaritaville in Crystal Beach. Far from shade! Zero risk a solar system will ever be "starved" from it's light source for any significant portion of time unless we have hurricanes that are also relatively short lived... I agree sun/UV is hard on equipment, over time we learn to offset and accommodate the situation if we want to enjoy our time. more backstory - I am originally from western Pennsylvania and lived/worked/camped there for my first 33 years so I haven't been a shade person much since then :D
#5 Solar - Gratifying and net positive - I'm right with you on that!

Let me now go start looking at my needs and additional requirements and see where we can go from there. I'll raise the power details here as I go. If at any point it makes sense for me to hire a design service, say it! I am not opposed to doing that, although as i mentioned I do want to treat it as a learning experience for myself. It's the "engineer" in me that just can't resist the constant thirst for additional knowledge, especially on the modern technology and security fronts!
Thank you all again!
 
Last edited:
Best thing to do is take your time, install a good battery monitor, and really figure out how big your battery bank and solar you need to do what you want. A proper solar setup isnt inexpensive but it gets a lot more expensive real fast if you have to start replacing components to upgrade down the road
 
As has been suggested and recommended several times by ya’ll, let’s start with a monitoring system/solution to get me started. I won't be in a hurry and will take my time. It seems to me I can start with monitoring existing appliances prior to fully understanding and inventorying the current and future requirements over the next days or so, so that will allow me to do some things in parallel to get my feet wet. I’ve already mentioned I’m gravitating towards quality equipment for the foundation, which seems to be Victron. I’m fine with that. From the monitoring and viewing perspective I see several things in their catalog of components that seem to fall into that category:

1) Victron Energy Cerbo GX MK2
2) Victron Energy Version 2 VE.Bus BMS Battery Management System
3) Victron Energy SmartSolar Pluggable Control Display
4) Victron Energy VE.Direct Smart Dongle (Bluetooth)
5) Victron Energy GX Touch 50 Display Screen
6) Victron Energy BMV-712 Smart Battery Monitor with Shunt
7) Victron Energy SmartShunt IP65 Battery Monitor (Bluetooth) - Victron Smart Shunt - 6.5V-70V, 500 amp

I’m reading and researching at this point to try to determine what the necessities are versus the "ultimate solution". I’m sure I wouldn’t need everything on this list (at least right away) but I’m still in the dark on what some of it does… Remote monitoring doesn't seem to be critical at this point. Did I miss anything important or fundamental? Is there an obvious qualifying “good battery monitor” in this list, and if so, what is that specifically? I gather a shunt solution is required for the real time and historical recording of measurements.
Thanks all, very very much appreciate your guidance!
 
By the way, my current factory battery panel situation is simple. I have a cheap single 100Ahr marine deep cycle battery and 2 x 200W Go Power panels on the roof with a cheap Go Power PWM charger. 30A shore power. The main frig/freezer in kitchen is DC, the outside "kitchen" is a small dorm size AC frig. More details to come...
 
The better the accuracy and precision of the monitor the more granular and detailed data you get. For some, knowing the minutia of where every watt goes is interesting or fun. At the end of the day the Ah used is the final answer and any basic monitor can do that. The more days you collect data the better representation you'll get for typical and peak use. From there you can with some confidence pick your storage with whatever cloudy day margin you want. That will then drive your panel size based on your desired recovery time. With your engineering background I would recommend starting a design spreadsheet, or find a template online. This way you can input insolation, efficiencies, loads, duty cycles, etc and see cause/effect for different configurations and operating conditions.

Mark B.
Albuquerque, NM
 
turner66 said:
1) Victron Energy Cerbo GX MK2
2) Victron Energy Version 2 VE.Bus BMS Battery Management System
3) Victron Energy SmartSolar Pluggable Control Display
4) Victron Energy VE.Direct Smart Dongle (Bluetooth)
5) Victron Energy GX Touch 50 Display Screen
6) Victron Energy BMV-712 Smart Battery Monitor with Shunt
7) Victron Energy SmartShunt IP65 Battery Monitor (Bluetooth) - Victron Smart Shunt - 6.5V-70V, 500 amp

I’m reading and researching at this point to try to determine what the necessities are versus the "ultimate solution". I’m sure I wouldn’t need everything on this list (at least right away) but I’m still in the dark on what some of it does… Remote monitoring doesn't seem to be critical at this point. Did I miss anything important or fundamental? Is there an obvious qualifying “good battery monitor” in this list, and if so, what is that specifically? I gather a shunt solution is required for the real time and historical recording of measurements.
Click to expand...

First and foremost, Victron components are networkable.

Here's where you start with Victron battery monitoring: SmartShunt.

Your smart phone then acts as a display via Bluetooth. The Victron SmartShunt is a replacement for the BMV-712 (item #6). You don't need both.

The next step would be to connect a Cerbo GX (item #1) to a SmartShunt and then add a Touch 50 (or 70) Display (item #5) to the Cerbo GX. The Touch 50 Display shows at a glance the current state of your electrical system. It also lets you change/set a number of parameters:
d0515481-3d6a-466c-8295-7325f0c485e3__24910.1675699786.PNG

Finally, a Cerbo GX allows you to remotely access your system via WiFi. Very very handy.

PS
The SmartSolar Pluggable Control Display (item #3) is used with Victron SmartSolar Charge Controllers like so . . .
pvinstall09.jpg
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

New posts

Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Try RV LIFE Pro Free for 7 Days

  • New Ad-Free experience on this RV LIFE Community.
  • Plan the best RV Safe travel with RV LIFE Trip Wizard.
  • Navigate with our RV Safe GPS mobile app.
  • and much more...
Try RV LIFE Pro Today
Back
Top Bottom