Newmar vs American coach

[Melissarv]

I have read previous threads but they aren't recent.

I am on my second Newmar (traded quickly from Bay Star to Dutch Star)

I need more sleeping room and looking into a custom build to finally get exactly what I want....

Has anyone owed both American Coach and Newmar ?

I'm looking for real info on the differences, is the liberty chassis harder to find service for...real owner feedback on the differences?

I love Newmar but the American coaches are also just stunning ....I'm torn. Pls advise so I can weigh all info as this next one will be my forever coach hopefully. I've sworn I'd never stray from Newmar as they are amending but the American coaches are in consideration.

 

[Utclmjmpr]

It's disappointing that both are orphans,,( from their original builders) I have an American Tradition that is 27 years old and has served all my needs over that period.. I like the Spartan chassis with its IFS and obviously Cummins and Allison as well,, I like the well thought out wiring and plumbing systems,, the well engineered placement of various items for practicality and common sense.. I am a "keeper" and don't trade much, and I do most of all my maintenance work so I value parts availability and information availability from Spartan,, something that you don't get much of from today's "name on the nose" brands..>>>Dan

 

[Larry N.]

It's disappointing that both are orphans,

Newmar's an orphan? A change at the top, but they're still around, unless I missed some major news...

 

[RV_Lee122]

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

I was an American Coach owner for a dozen years (2004 American Tradition 40V). Traveled around with friends who owned Newmars, Country Coach, and Monacos, and we often compared notes. All "near luxury" coaches too. They all had a lot of plusses compared to mid and entry level models, but none of them perfect. In fact, each had a few shortcomings that make you wonder how they were ever allowed to be in an otherwise excellent coach. I suspect the design engineers sometimes wondered the same, unsure how a seemingly good feature or piece of engineering ended up a PITA. I could go on in that vein for some time, but you probably aren't looking for a philosophical discussion.

The American Coach Liberty chassis isn't actually unique. It's two standard Spartan modules, front & rear, connected by a Fleetwood engineered "Liberty Bridge". Winnebago does the same thing on their best models using the FCCC (Freightliner) modular chassis and a Winnebago-built center section. In both cases, the chassis is Spartan (or Freightliner) as far as any mechanical shop is concerned. The modules contain all the suspension, steering, engine, transmission, braking,cooling, and air system components, built in a Spartan (or FCCC) factor and delivered to the coach builder, ready to be bolted/welded to the center bridge which contains the storage bays and a skeleton for the floor above.

The top-line coaches from Newmar and AC all share what I'll loosely call "good bones". It starts with a chassis spec'ed to carry a large & heavy coach with finesse; no shortcuts under the covers has in lower-priced models. Add to that solid "house" engineering, e.g. electrical systems & plumbing, installed to high standards of workmanship. Well laid out and fused and valved for both safety and future maintenance. See Utclmjmpr's reply for more examples.

A choice between them might depend on which years & models you were most interested in. Back in early 2000 up to around 2007, I leaned toward AC (and the Monaco's of that same era too). After that, I think Newmar had the edge. But neither brand had enough extra to reject the other if that other one had a feature or just plain good looks that made your day.

As for orphans, neither are or will be. Newmar is now a subsidiary of Winnebago and Fleetwood-AC will soon be sold en bloc to another corporation. So changes of ownership & upper corporate management, but both remain in business.

 

[Utclmjmpr]

My reference to "orphans, ment that both are under new management and in my opinion
are not worth the insane money todays model bring.. Example: My brother just bought a new 2025 Dutch Star at 680K plus,,and just had the first oil change at $ 980.00.. He had to replace a damaged steer tire,,$1400.00 for a TIRE.. A scratch in the paint that did not include any body work,,$12500.00 .. a rear bay door that was damaged,, $6000.00 for the door unpainted... This from the largest and respected Newmar dealer in Oregon and its his third Newmar product..>>>Dan

 

[RV_Lee122]

Thats insane ^. The same couple above just bought a new Phaeton for 400K out the door

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

A 2025, 43 ft Dutch Star with a $700k MSRP sells for about $550k-$600k at the dealer. I think your will find a 2025 Phaeton in that size runs nearly as much. More than $400k, to be sure. Many buyers would say the Dutch Star is superior in fit & finish, but that's subjective and hard to put a price tag on. Premium features tend to have premium prices to match.

Dealer prices for anything on these elegant coaches are extravagant (I'm being polite). Buying a big Class A tire at dealer prices is like throwing money away - you can expect to pay a 20% premium vs a commercial truck & bus tire shop. Ditto for most body work. I remember discovering a bulging sidewall on a big front tire on my American Tradition while at the dealer. Wasn't about to drive away like that, so had the dealer replace for $860 (2008 prices). Checked with a local commercial tire shop on that same tire and was quoted $670. [ I sent a copy of that quote to the dealership service manager and he quietly refunded the difference.]

 

[Utclmjmpr]

After consulting with me he shopped around his area at various tire shops,, best buy at $1400.00 was Les Schwab in Grants Pass, Or... This coach also has the 450 horse engine and 4K series trans..>>>Dan

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Guessing the coach uses a 315/80R22.5, so that's an expensive tire no matter where you buy, but if you get Toyos instead of Michelins it's 2/3 that price.

 

[Utclmjmpr]

I offered the same advice,, but it came with a full set of Michelins, and you are right about the size, they are a premium... I am very comfortable with Toyo steers and Hankook's across the rear for my coach,, they get the job done..>>>Dan

 

[Ken & Sheila]

Front tires on a Dutch Star are 365/70/22.5r (front axle is 19,000lbs)
There are NOT cheap.
Rear drive axle and tags are 315/80/22.5r

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Front tires on a Dutch Star are 365/70/22.5r (front axle is 19,000lbs)

WOW!

 

[RayIN]

Gary, back in the 2000's decade Spartan used Reyco-Granning steering and rear suspension modules. Coach mfgrs, built the center frame to their specs. That same practice might still exist today.

 

[Utclmjmpr]

Mine is also a STACKED FRAME ( One I beam stacked on another)thru the center to resist twisting >>>Dan

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Gary, back in the 2000's decade Spartan used Reyco-Granning steering and rear suspension modules. Coach mfgrs, built the center frame to their specs. That same practice might still exist today.

No "might" about it. The "modular chassis" has been one of the standard chassis offerings from both Spartan and FCCC since around 2003. Fleetwood/AmericanCoach & Winnebago make extensive use of it for their higher end models. Tiffin does too, but they have FCCC assemble their version (called the PowerGlide chassis) at the FCCC factory.