Older Tiffin Class A vs. newer models - advice?

[rgnprof1]

We've owned an older (1993) 29FT Class C (no slides) for 12+ years. We have really gotten our money's worth out it and have had it all over the country. Looking to upgrade to a newer model as I approach retirement - would like something a little less work. We are also pretty budget conscious and have no intention of spending more than $75k.

We are looking for shorter Class As, but might just go with a C. Lately, I've been looking for 30 ft - or less - Class As. Have found a bunch from 2012 - 2018 or so, that fit within our budget. Then I came across a 2000 Tiffin Alegro 28 for $20k and a 2000 Tiffin Allegro Bus for $26k. Both have low miles - which I know is also a concern...But my question is I know nothing about these older Tiffins other than generally a Tiffin is one of the higher end models; so is this 2000 model just too old or does the fact that it's a Tiffin counteract some of that? Would I be better off with a mid 2010s Winnebago, Thor, Fleetwood etc? The Tiffins do not have slides - which is simpler, but also an obviously smaller living area.

I guess my general question is should I try to buy as new as possible, or do some models justify looking back a few more years?

The advantage of the Tiffins is we would buy them outright. The $50k - $75 we would probably finance some of the cost.

Any advice?

Thank you in advance!

ryan

 

[Isaac-1]

Tiffin has moved significantly more up market in the last 25 years, in the early 2000's they were much more of a mid tier / entry level brand, but one known for good value for the price.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

I'll probably offend some owners when I say that a Tiffin of the 1990's & early 2000's is not a notably "high end model". Tiffin is a full-range manufacturer, with some entry level models and some more upscale ones (the Allegro Bus & Zephyr). They made their reputation more on outstanding customer service and value rather than on amenities or even quality.

Put aside your car buyer mentality and don't get wrapped up in model year & mileage. You are buying a furnished house that happens to have wheels, so what matters most is the condition of the house and appliances and how well it fits your usability needs (size, layout, etc). The wheeled part has to function, of course, but that too is mostly a matter of verifying condition.

Buying newer doesn't change any of the above, especially since you aren't talking about really new. I would have made the same remarks about a 2010 Winnebago, or even a 2010 Foretravel or American Eagle. Condition is the key, not model year.

I'd say a 2000 Allegro Bus is an terrific candidate and buying it at the right price so you can have a cash reserve for the inevitable maintenance needs is a smart choice. But that assumes (a) the Bus meets your space and comfort needs, and (b) all the condition factors evaluate as acceptable or readily correctable. Tires & batteries are easy to replace (easy but not cheap), but water leaks, faulty appliances, etc. can be a lot more challenging. Especially if you will need to depend on RV shops for the work.

A question: a 2000 Allegro Bus would be a diesel pusher and probably at least 32 ft; a 2000 Allegro 28 is almost surely a front gas engine model. A lot more vehicle differences than maybe you were aware of?

 

[rgnprof1]

Thank you for the replies! The Tiffin Allegro Bus is a 28 ft 2000 model on the Chevrolet Workhorse (454 7.4L). It's got 28K miles on it and it's sitting at $26,000.

We weren't really interested in a Diesel but I just ran across a 30 ft. 2003 Holiday Rambler Neptune with 42k miles for $46,000.

This gets real confusing, real fast! But I do appreciate the input!

 

[Utclmjmpr]

Once you go Cummins diesel/ Allison,, you won't go back..>>>Dan

 

[CharlesinGA]

Once you go Cummins diesel/ Allison,, you won't go back..>>>Dan

To a degree. Beginning with the 2003 model RAM trucks, the Cummins 5.9L introduced the common rail electronic fuel injection system. I am not familiar with the larger Cummins motors enough to know if that was true on them too or if the change over happened earlier or later.

What I do know is that the common rail electronic fuel injection system makes the engine run measurably smoother, quieter, produce more power with almost no other changes, and have better fuel economy.

Knowing what I know now, I would not want a diesel that precedes the common rail models. They are noisy, smelly, produce less power, and consume quite a bit more fuel.

Charles

 

[Utclmjmpr]

My 8.3 12 valve pre-electronic, gets me a respectable 10 MPG at a speed of 65 and towing,, the coach is 39 ft. and weighs 31K loaded.. Plenty of torque and power plus very enviable mileage for the conditions and mileage of 146K...>>>Dan ( And I don't sweat the electronics failures.)

 

[Laura & Charles]

Gary is absolutely right about buying a house first, a vehicle far secondarily. However, if you’re willing to consider a diesel, I thing you’ll find much upscale, any vintage, with a diesel chassis. Our first rig was a gasser and pretty considered pretty much a top end gasser. She was fine for us for 3.5 years, but we knew going in she was our ‘starter coach’ and when we traded to this DP, OMG what an improvement!

I wouldn’t hesitate on a 2003 Neptune chassis (AGAIN: house is more important… but chassis maintenance history matters!). Find a floor plan the MRS likes (not just can live with… she must really like it).

With diesels, pre 2009-ish you won’t have to deal with DEF. (Though our 2012 MaxxForce 10 doesn’t need DEF, but it’s got it’s own set of caveats… should you run into one of those you’re interested in, I’ll elaborate.). 2008-9 seems to be a year many draw a line at. When it comes to electronics, 2012 or so is a line as well..

So make up your mind about what matters. DEF? Slim line LED TVs?, etc…. I personally wouldn’t let length be a huge factor, but that’s me≥. Our first coach was 38’… this one is nearly 45’. Driving them is not a lot different. There’s places she won’t fit, but we can get close our target and use our car to explore.

 

[rgnprof1]

Really helpful replies - and I'm thankful! Been reading on the 2003 Cummins ISB 5.9L and it does have the Bosch high-pressure rail injection system. I'm a little concerned about it being under-powered as we do plan to pull a Subaru Forester.

We really like the floor plan - it's just the coach is a long way from us, so not very easy to look at. We figure if things don't work out now, there will always be another...we're not in that big of a hurry). And, I am a bit worried about the diesel aspect (I like to do my own work and while I'm not completely unfamiliar with diesels - I owned a 78 Merc 300D - they do seem hader to work on, harder to get parts for and just more expensive to maintain).

 

[Isaac-1]

Buy what is right for you, not everyone wants a 45 ft tag axle diesel pusher, as to your concern about the 5.9L ISB being under powered, a lot depends on why GVWR chassis it is mated to, stick with a relatively smaller / lighter say 26,000 GVWR chassis and you will likely be fine, though you may perhaps be going slower than you want to when driving up mountain passes, which for most people is way less than 1% of the time.

 

[Laura & Charles]

Really helpful replies - and I'm thankful! Been reading on the 2003 Cummins ISB 5.9L and it does have the Bosch high-pressure rail injection system. I'm a little concerned about it being under-powered as we do plan to pull a Subaru Forester.

We really like the floor plan - it's just the coach is a long way from us, so not very easy to look at. We figure if things don't work out now, there will always be another...we're not in that big of a hurry). And, I am a bit worried about the diesel aspect (I like to do my own work and while I'm not completely unfamiliar with diesels - I owned a 78 Merc 300D - they do seem hader to work on, harder to get parts for and just more expensive to maintain).

Our Rosie has gotten us over every hill we ever pointed her at, and we’ve been across this country 3 times and grades as steep as they come. That Cummins will haul you and your toad just fine. It’s not a race (or if it is, you won’t win, but you WILL get to the finish line). Although I know my way around a tool box pretty well, I’m too old to contort my body to do much in way of repair or maintenance… I just can’t bend and squat like I used to. That said, the cost to pay somebody else to maintain the prior gasser and the current diesel isn’t enough for us to worry about.

I think if you can change fluids and filters on a gasser, you should be able to do the same on a diesel..

 

[Laura & Charles]

Isaac is right. As full timers, we spend AT MOST 5% of our time in the coach driving. BUT, I still maintain, the house quality, at least CAN BE, superior on a diesel platform. (Again, our original gasser was the near perfect starter rig for us…. I’m NOT an anti gasser.)

 

[Utclmjmpr]

With a diesel,,, you won't be hearing the engine under a "doghouse" screaming at you..Plus you get superior air brakes..>>>Dan

 

[UTTransplant]

Really helpful replies - and I'm thankful! Been reading on the 2003 Cummins ISB 5.9L and it does have the Bosch high-pressure rail injection system. I'm a little concerned about it being under-powered as we do plan to pull a Subaru Forester.

I am a long time Subaru fan, but only a few older standard transmission models are towable four down. That fact is why I had to get rid of my beloved Subaru Outback when we bought a motorhome. Just be careful.

 

[rgnprof1]

Yea, we bought ours in 2014 and have been towing it since - it's a 6spd. Subaru - in 2013 - said this was fine with the manual transmission, but I think they changed their minds about the Foresters in 2015, 2016...

 

[Kodiak34SS]

The models you've talked about are all different beasts, great in their own ways. You seem to understand that condition is everything with regards to a used rig, so....go with your gut! Which one do you like?

 

[Professor David]

This gets real confusing, real fast! But I do appreciate the input!

We went through a similar search about a year ago. As you know, take your time and continue to do your research. The right rig will appear. We found a nice rig with low miles but needed to put money into it to bring it up to speed (new tires, shocks, rear bushings, TV upgrades, etc...). Originally, I figured it would take about 5k but ended up spending about twice that amount...so far. Prices for used rigs seem to have come down to realistic prices recently, which helps. Please keep us informed of your process.

 

[Kirk]

This gets real confusing, real fast!

Keep in mind that there is no make/model/year of RV that is so perfect that it has no unhappy customers and there is none so bad that it has no supporters. The older the RV the more important condition becomes and you would be wise to have any used RV professionally inspected before you purchase it. Do not choose based on appearance as there can be a disaster lurking under a beautiful finish.

We figure if things don't work out now, there will always be another...

That is a very important thing to keep in mind as you shop. In most cases there is even a better choice available if you keep looking.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

The Tiffin Allegro Bus is a 28 ft 2000 model on the Chevrolet Workhorse (454 7.4L). It's got 28K miles on it and it's sitting at $26,000.

That's NOT a bargain price for an older gas-chassis Bus, but again condition and suitability for your needs should dictate your choice and what you are willing to pay. RV pricing is nothing like car pricing, so average book values don't mean much at all.

 

[rgnprof1]

Thanks all - Gary - that's what I don't know - if average book values don't mean anything it's rather difficult to figure out what a good price is! And I do understand the issue - book values, so many variables...I guess I need someone to say "That's NOT a bargain price...."