Possible Converter Damage After 50 Amp Power Issue

[garyb1st]

Likely cause. My best guesses. First, 50 Amp plug not fully pushed into receptacle possibly causing short when power turned on. DW setting up while I went to park HQ to pay. Came back and she mentioned a problem with the power. She heard a popping sound and then noticed a sweet smell. Microwave dead. Pulled it out, tested the ceramic fuse and it was still good. But it will not start. Second, transfer switch damaged.

Batteries not being charged by shore power or generator. Checked the two 40 amp fuses on the converter. Still good. Started engine and batteries taking charge. Initially 65 to 75 amps going in when engine running. After a few minutes it settles down to about 50 amps going in. Don't have a B to B so will only run for short periods. Would like to get the batteries to more than 50% so the refrigerator keeps running over night.

I'm thinking that maybe the converter is toast but since the fuses are not blown, is that possible? If not the converter, could it possibly be the transfer switch? For now I'm using the Honda to power my computer so I can post this.

If the converter I'll pick one up and put it in. If the transfer switch, I wouldn't know what to do. If anyone has any other thoughts please let me know.

Thanks.

 

[DonTom]

I'm thinking that maybe the converter is toast but since the fuses are not blown, is that possible?

Yes, it is possible.

But converters are easy to test. Just check on the batteries for around 13.5 to 14.5 VDC out when you have shore power. If lower, then check at the converter output.

Higher output voltage if you have lith batteries.

If lower voltage than above, then check the 120 VAC input on the input of the converter. If it shows normal, then your converter is the problem.

If your converter is not working, for now, just go buy a cheap battery charger at any auto parts store and connect it up to your house batteries. It will keep things running in your RV as well as charge your batteries.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[garyb1st]

Batteries are not being charged via shore power or the generator. They are charged when the engine is running.

 

[DonTom]

Batteries are not being charged via shore power or the generator. They are charged when the engine is running.

The converter is NOT used when the engine is running. It is only used when you have shore power or the genny running.

If you do not want to run your engine for most of the night, go buy yourself a battery charger. Head for Wal*Mart if the auto parts places are closed.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[garyb1st]

Batteries are just over 60%. That will keep us going over night. Even with the 12v fridge we only use about 40 amps a day when not connected to shore power.

 

[DonTom]

we only use about 40 amps a day when not connected to shore power.

That will be AH (amp-hours) which is a lot different than amps.

For an example, you can draw 80 amps from a fully charged 40AH battery for a half hour and then you have a discharged battery.

Or 20 amps for two hours, etc. from a 40AH battery.

IOW, 40 amps for one hour from a 40AH battery.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[CharlesinGA]

Your 120v AC sounds like it isn't getting into the RV. Take something that is 120v powered, hair dryer, plug in lamp, etc, and test every outlet in the RV. If dead, its very possibly the transfer switch or the main breaker.

Charles

 

[DonTom]

Your 120v AC sounds like it isn't getting into the RV.

Somehow, I forgot to ask the obvious!

But that would have been noticed by the lack of 120 VAC at the converter input that I suggested.

But that gives me an idea--is the refrigerator stuck on propane or does it say it is running on AC?

If it cannot go to AC and stay there, it proves an AC problem when you have shore power.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[garyb1st]

Correct, I mean amp hours.

We have 120 power in the Motorhome. We can use either the campground pedestal or our Onan generator. All receptacles are working. I'm hoping that means the transfer switch is OK. If so, I'll find a converter and put it in.

Our 12 volt refrigerator works but it is wired directly to the batteries.

 

[TheBar]

If you do not want to run your engine for most of the night, go buy yourself a battery charger. Head for Wal*Mart if the auto parts places are closed.

-Don- Reno, NV

Or even better get an old fashioned analog Harbor Freight battery charger. Most chargers today are microprocessor controlled and may not deliver a steady 12v charge. I have a pulse charger that does not.

 

[garyb1st]

Could have picked up a charger at HF yesterday if I knew I left my Battery Tender(s) at the SB. For now we're charging at the rate of 50+ amps per gallon of gas using the big Vortec 8.1 for 15 to 20 minutes at a time. Costly way but not more so than a refrigerator of spoiled food. Hopefully not doing any damage to the alternator.

 

[DonTom]

Hopefully not doing any damage to the alternator.

Nope. That alternator will see things as normal. There were times I had to do that too, when boondocked with an Onan genny I couldn't start.

The vehicle engine only uses a little more gasoline than the Onan. But I step on the accelerator pedal once in a while because it may not be good for the engine to leave it at an idle for long times.

It just uses more gasoline, and not that much more at idle compared to the Onan at a half load. Compare 0.67 to a half load on the Onan at 0.5 Gallons Per Hour:

For my Y2k 7.4 L engine:

700 RPM (my normal warm idle): 0.67 GPH.
1K RPM:1.04 GPH
2K RPM:1.94 GPH
3K RPM:3.05 GPH

Onan 4KW genny:

• No Load: Approximately 0.29–0.3 GPH.
• Half Load: Approximately 0.48–0.5 GPH.
• Full Load: Approximately 0.7–0.71 GPH.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[Lou Schneider]

The likely problem was the neutral pin in the middle of the two hot pins on the 50 amp plug did not make contact when it was partially plugged into the socket. The neutral anchors the midpoint of the 240 volts between the two hot pins, dividing it into two 120 volt feeds.

Without a functioning neutral the 240 volts will divide unequally, putting excessive voltage on some 120 volt circuits and everything connected to them.

This can't happen with 30 amp RV power - the 30 amp socket only has 120 volts available so a missing neutral just breaks the circuit and no power flows.

If there will be a delay in getting a replacement converter, I second The Bar's suggestion to go to Harbor Freight and get an old form 2-10-50 amp battery charger to get you by. Put it in the 10 amp position and put it across the house battery and let it continually charge. It should keep you going indefinitely.

Something like this - a dumb charger that doesn't have an automatic cutoff or other microprocessor control.

50 Amp, 12V Analog Charger with Engine Start

 

[DonTom]

Most chargers today are microprocessor controlled and may not deliver a steady 12v charge.

Even at HFT these days. My HFT charger was purcahsed years ago and it is microprocessor controlled.

See here.

I would think it will still work for a house battery, just perhaps not as well as the older analog ones.


-Don- Reno, NV

 

[DonTom]

I second The Bar's suggestion to go to Harbor Freight and get an old form 2-10-50 amp battery charger to get you by if there will be a delay in replacing the converter. Put it in the 10 amp position and put it across the house battery and let it continually charge. It's also useful if your starting battery needs a charge.

50 Amp, 12V Analog Charger with Engine Start

Oh, I didn't realize HFT still had those. They cost less and work better for at least some things.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[Lou Schneider]

Oh, I didn't realize HFT still had those. They cost less and work better for at least some things.

-Don- Reno, NV

Harbor Freight is known for perpetuating obsolete technology. Besides this battery charger, they're still selling Modified Sine Wave inverters while the rest of the world has long since graduated to pure sine wave.

1500 Watt Continuous/3000 Watt Peak Modified Sine Wave Power Inverter

Amazing deals on this 1500 Watt / 3000 Watt Power Inverter at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.

www.harborfreight.com

 

[DonTom]

they're still selling Modified Sine Wave inverters while the rest of the world has long since graduated to pure sine wave.

But these days they are selling both types. Here is one of them.

But I have several Modified Squarewave (no need there to lie about it, IMO) Inverters and they have always worked well for me with anything I have tried.

I just purchased a couple of MSW inverters that I received a few days ago. Very handy as I have many Bauer Batteries as I also have many Bauer tools. I have the adapters (very odd size) and 12V outlets too for the 12 VDC output.

HFT also sells them, but they have been out of stock everywhere and cost ten bucks more and have no 12-volt output.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[John From Detroit]

Generally MSW or PSW/TSW does not matter much.

When you have radios that can hear a 5 watt transmitter a a hundred miles away or more.

It matters. May affect televiosion/radio/starlink/hughesnet... or not.

 

[Kirk]

We can use either the campground pedestal or our Onan generator. All receptacles are working. I'm hoping that means the transfer switch is OK. If so, I'll find a converter and put it in.

You are correct that this does eliminate the auto transfer device and means that it works. You have not said if your Pace Arrow is 30A or 50A. As Lou said, the neutral problem can't happen to a 30A RV because it only has 1 leg of 120V. If you have a volt/ohm meter that would help a great deal in troubleshooting. Just replacing parts to see if that works can get very expensive and frustrating.

 

[DonTom]

Generally MSW or PSW/TSW does not matter much.

When you have radios that can hear a 5 watt transmitter a a hundred miles away or more.

It matters. May affect televiosion/radio/starlink/hughesnet... or not.

With the big exception of very expensive commercial inverters designed for radio equipment, I find the very worse inverters for QRN are the cheap pure sine wave inverters. I have one that is pure sine wave that radiates more QRN than any of my many MSW inverters, but its sinewave is as clean as can be. I assume the cheaper pure sinewave inverters have more oscillators inside or just have more garbage out on the ham bands because of the harmonics of the countless internal oscillators and switching.

-Don- Verdi, NV