Service Expectations

[saurd]

My general question is what level of service is standard in this industry. I am finding it frustrating coming from a career as a supplier to the OEM automotive industry. Many things about my 2 year experience with this has me asking questions, just looking to frame my expectations.

I am new to the forum and 4 years into owning our 5th wheel. Our existing unit we purchased new as a 2022 hold over in the spring of 2023. On one of our first major trips we discovered a major issue, un-even tire wear. Long story and going on the second round of long stents are the dealer to get it addressed. Brief description of the issue -

The issues was reported to the dealer in July of 2023 and several trips to get things checked out and making it available for measurements to help them determine what the issues are. The unit was dropped off at the dealer in late September of that year to get is repaired. Was not able to get the unit back unit Mar of 2024. It was identified that the alignment was off due to the mounts which hold the axles to the frame. These were cut off and reattached. A new set of tires was also installed.​

​

Now being sensitized to tire wear I monitored it though out he 2024 camping season. Traveled right at 7,000 miles and there was notable uneven tire wear still present. Continued to keep the dealership posted of the measurements showing the trend through out the season. The unit was returned to the dealer early November 2024 to figure out the cause of the uneven tire wear. Just learned one of the 2 axles will be replaced. Dealer still has the unit.​

During the process it felt as if they were holding me the customer and the defective camper hostage as the dealer worked to see who would be responsible for the repair of the defect. I do believe in getting the root cause and fixing that. However as the dealer battled with the manufacturer and then the suppler of the axles to the manufacturer to determine who is responsible for the defect nothing is done to get the customer made whole and happy. To me making the customer whole/happy should be the top priority, not who is going to fund the needed repair, that battle can go no once the customer in on down the road. So far did not miss any usage of the camper but just wanted to get a better understanding of the industry itself prior to casting stones at any of the parties involved in this issue.

Will provide further details as needed. Just looking to set realistic expectations for my own sanity.

Thanks in advance for the input

 

[rvlifer]

It is 100% buyer beware. There are some good companies out there and a lot of bad ones. The bad ones will do anything they can to make money

 

[Larry N.]

My general question is what level of service is standard in this industry.

Unfortunately there IS no standard. As rvlifer mentions above, it's dependent on who you're dealing with. There are some excellent dealers and a few good manufacturers, but there are all too many companies who are just out for the buck, not caring about customer satisfaction, quality work, or anything else except sales for as much as they can get and minimal service, many not even caring about repeat business.

I've had excellent luck with Transwest, in their Firestone, CO shop, but there aren't many dealers around who are that good. On the little I've needed from them Newmar (for the coach) and Freightliner (for the chassis) have done well, too.

So what ya sees is what ya get...

 

[CharlesinGA]

I would say the OP is/has experienced what 98% of new RV owners have, poor service from the dealers. Its the norm from what I have read over several years on many different forums.

If you have torsion axles, the uneven tire wear is probably not unusual. It seems that Dexter replaces a lot of torsion axles under warranty due to tire wear issues. The Escape forum is full of people saying that Dexter is replacing the axles for tire wear. While I have read it on the Airstream forum, it doesn't seem as common, possibly Airstream dealers and the Mother Ship are quicker reacting and take care of buyers, and it just doesn't get talked about, dunno.

Charles

 

[uchu]

Other than the issues that are commonly found in new RVs, which are themselves a major problem, I really have a pet peeve with the fact that dealers take many months to solve a relatively simple issue. That's unacceptable, IMO.

 

[Boat Bum]

Other than the issues that are commonly found in new RVs, which are themselves a major problem, I really have a pet peeve with the fact that dealers take many months to solve a relatively simple issue. That's unacceptable, IMO.

Especially in warranty period. Boat's are even worse.

 

[Onyrlef]

Other than the issues that are commonly found in new RVs, which are themselves a major problem, I really have a pet peeve with the fact that dealers take many months to solve a relatively simple issue. That's unacceptable, IMO.

The problem for an RV dealer is their service dept., unlike a new car dealer's, is largely a liability. A new car dealer's service dept. and body shop is a cash cow. An RV dealer's service dept. on the other hand is a break even at best, understaffed and underpaid prospect, a pita the dealer tolerates only because he has to.

 

[Onyrlef]

I would say the OP is/has experienced what 98% of new RV owners have, poor service from the dealers. Its the norm from what I have read over several years on many different forums.

If you have torsion axles, the uneven tire wear is probably not unusual. It seems that Dexter replaces a lot of torsion axles under warranty due to tire wear issues. The Escape forum is full of people saying that Dexter is replacing the axles for tire wear. While I have read it on the Airstream forum, it doesn't seem as common, possibly Airstream dealers and the Mother Ship are quicker reacting and take care of buyers, and it just doesn't get talked about, dunno.

Charles

I wonder is it a camber issue ? Isn't the camber in a torsion axle maintained by the tension of the rubber bands inside the axle? If the deflection is different the tires would wear differently. If the deflection in one axle were negative, as in reverse camber, those tires would show excessive wear on the inside. If there was on the other hand little to no deflection those tires would wear on the outside.

 

[saurd]

Thank you to all who took the time to respond. It confirmed what was suspected. Great sanity check.

Thanks again.

 

[Kirk]

Part of the problem is that few if any RV dealers have any techs who are really qualified for dealing with the kind of problems that you are having. While the RV manufacturers have the financial resources to send you to a qualified frame shop, most dealers don't or won't use them. Your best hope for a correction is probably to take it to the factory where it was built.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

The problem for an RV dealer is their service dept., unlike a new car dealer's, is largely a liability. A new car dealer's service dept. and body shop is a cash cow. An RV dealer's service dept. on the other hand is a break even at best, understaffed and underpaid prospect, a pita the dealer tolerates only because he has to.

That's not always the case - some dealers (usually larger ones and in the southern climate zone) have high volume service departments, much like auto dealers. But they are swamped with customers, plagued by long waits for parts, and suffer the same difficulty finding skilled techs that most other repair businesses have.

Smaller shops and those located where RVing is seasonal have the problem of lack of sales or service in the off-season. For that reason, they lay workers off and don't invest heavily in training or equipment. And yes, that means their service shop is often break-even or worse. They are understaffed and under-skilled in season, so workmanship is sloppy and they get a lot of come-backs too.

 

[Onyrlef]

That's not always the case - some dealers (usually larger ones and in the southern climate zone) have high volume service departments, much like auto dealers. But they are swamped with customers, plagued by long waits for parts, and suffer the same difficulty finding skilled techs that most other repair businesses have.

Smaller shops and those located where RVing is seasonal have the problem of lack of sales or service in the off-season. For that reason, they lay workers off and don't invest heavily in training or equipment. And yes, that means their service shop is often break-even or worse. They are understaffed and under-skilled in season, so workmanship is sloppy and they get a lot of come-backs too.

A car dealerships service operation and that of an RV dealer, regardless the volume, are not anything alike.

 

[Kirk]

and suffer the same difficulty finding skilled techs that most other repair businesses have.

Adding to the problem is that very few RV techs have much education on electrical theory so when they run into a complex electrical problem, they tend to try to use the parts changing tactic. As a result, many of the more complex appliances, like air conditioners and refrigerators get replaced because the RV tech doesn't know how to find the problem.

 

[Onyrlef]

Adding to the problem is that very few RV techs have much education on electrical theory so when they run into a complex electrical problem, they tend to try to use the parts changing tactic. As a result, many of the more complex appliances, like air conditioners and refrigerators get replaced because the RV tech doesn't know how to find the problem.

Those items get replaced because first thing that's going to happen after a service tech replaces one part in your 15 year old refrigerator or rooftop a/c and something else fails in 6 months, you're going to be back there raising hell and leaving bad reviews.

 

[Oldgator73]

Smaller shops and those located where RVing is seasonal have the problem of lack of sales or service in the off-season. For that reason, they lay workers off and don't invest heavily in training or equipment. And yes, that means their service shop is often break-even or worse. They are understaffed and under-skilled in season, so workmanship is sloppy and they get a lot of come-backs too.

We had a problem with leaking windows on our Winnabego TT. It was still in the warranty period. Unfortunately the dealership was in Michigan and we live in Delaware. We did take the RV to the dealer once but they failed to fix the problem. No local dealerships would work on it since we didn’t purchase from them. I did find a small dealer in Maryland that agreed to work on it. Like Gary said this was one of those dealerships with maybe two techs. They sell and maintain boats and RV’s. He fixed one window and told me he couldn’t do the other one because the factory stiffed him on the bill. He charged what the “book” said to charge. I would get emails from Winnebago that included a newsletter. I responded to the email with the aforementioned experience. I was contacted by the factory service manager and invited to bring the unit to them which we did. They worked on it and lo and behold the window still leaked. Their fix for it was to send me a new window and tell me they were done with it. Our son and I installed the new window and the leak was abated.

 

[Knobs1]

Well, then... no future Winnebago purchases...
...

 

[Oldgator73]

Well, then... no future Winnebago purchases...
...

Just purchase local so you don’t have to drive ten hours to get it worked on. Or better yet buy used and maybe all the bugs will be worked out.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Well, then... no future Winnebago purchases...
...

And they are one of the better manufacturers for product support.

 

[Knobs1]

And they are one of the better manufacturers for product support.

So I thought, but these three things in the post by @Oldgator73 are worrisome about them these days:

(1) No local dealerships would work on it since we didn’t purchase from them

(2) he couldn’t do the other one because the factory stiffed him on the bill (Reason for #1?)

(3) Their fix for it was to send me a new window and tell me they were done with it.

Just purchase local so you don’t have to drive ten hours to get it worked on. Or better yet buy used and maybe all the bugs will be worked out.

Sometimes people move.

A national manufacturer with national dealers should stand behind both their product and their dealers.

 

[Oldgator73]

Sometimes people move.

A national manufacturer with national dealers should stand behind both their product and their dealers.

Yes, folks do move and some people fulltime. There is a Winnebago dealership about 5 miles from us. I talked to them about purchasing the same TT from them but the dealership in Michigan gave us a better deal. The salesman at our local dealership told me good luck getting it worked on. You may not experience that situation. If you buy used you may not have to worry about any of this. I talked to a mobile RV tech and he said he won’t do warranty work. He said RV manufacturers are famous for not paying for work done. He tells customers they have to pay him and try to get reimbursed by the factory.