This is really sad

[Cmprman]

Unacceptable what is happening

 

[Oldgator73]

Sadly this is what tens of millions of Americans wanted.

 

[Domo]

It will take time to sort out the pork and the justifiable expenses. I don't think anyone believed it would be easy and painless as we're seeing.

 

[IBTripping]

In 2023, the National Park Service contributed $55.6 billion to the U.S. economy, while its budget was $3.6 billion. This indicates a significant positive economic impact of the parks, far exceeding the direct funding they receive. It is possible that eliminating significant staff will result in lower service that discourages visitors which is likely to reduce the Park Service's economic contribution. It's like saving money by not paying to maintain your tow vehicle. Short term savings resulting in much higher long term costs.

 

[JudyJB]

One thing that I have noticed lately, and I am not sure of the cause, but national and state parks are closing check-in booths as early as 4-5 pm. This means a lot of people arriving later than those hours are not paying an entrance fee.

I recently left Zion National Park and also noticed that the visitor center closed at 4 pm. The next door bookstore and gift shop was run by a private company, so it stayed open until 8 pm. I am not sure of the financial result of visitor centers closing so early, but it is possible that people do not stay as long if they cannot get information about trails and such.

 

[Isaac-1]

Keep in mind when you look at all this that the NPS budget has increased by nearly 50% in the last decade, though of course that does not account for inflation.

 

[old RV guy]

Keep in mind when you look at all this that the NPS budget has increased by nearly 50% in the last decade, though of course that does not account for inflation.

Keep in mind the pentagon budget was 693 billion in 2019 and is proposed to be 1 trillion for 2025. Keeping in mind too that if China with a military budget 1/3 that of the US invades Taiwan there's nothing the US can do but watch. Gamed out by the pentagon the US loses a war with China 10 out of 10 times. DOGE waste, fraud and abuse cuts at the pentagon have laughably amounted to a rounding error.

 

[CamperAL]

I wonder who will run things when the U.S. goes bankrupt?

 

[old RV guy]

I wonder who will run things when the U.S. goes bankrupt?

Why the bankruptors of course. A new order cannot coexist with an existing order, it can only replace it. Fear and hate are the incubators for change.

 

[TheBar]

We frequent 4 COE campgrounds within 30 miles of us, These are some of the nicest spots in their system. The 2 local gatekeepers at our favorite spot had been there 8 years. According to them their budget was cut in late 2023 and they were both being laid off. But no news of that can be found on the internet.

But the effects are obvious. So starting in 2024 instead of having 2 gate attendants at each campground there is only one that is required to service 3 of the 4. The gatekeeper is at each site only 2 hours per day. There is constant turnover because they have to drive 50 miles/day. The number of campground "hosts" was also cut in half so regular maintenance like blowing leaves and emptying firepits isn't done daily. There was discussion on this forum about their budget cuts in September 2024.

 

[old RV guy]

We frequent 4 COE campgrounds within 30 miles of us, These are some of the nicest spots in their system. The 2 local gatekeepers at our favorite spot had been there 8 years. According to them their budget was cut in late 2023 and they were both being laid off. But no news of that can be found on the internet.

But the effects are obvious. So starting in 2024 instead of having 2 gate attendants at each campground there is only one that is required to service 3 of the 4. The gatekeeper is at each site only 2 hours per day. There is constant turnover because they have to drive 50 miles/day. The number of campground "hosts" was also cut in half so regular maintenance like blowing leaves and emptying firepits isn't done daily. There was discussion on this forum about their budget cuts in September 2024.

Kinda like in equivocation speak, jaywalking and murdering your wife with an ax are both against the law so they're the same.

 

[UTTransplant]

Keep in mind when you look at all this that the NPS budget has increased by nearly 50% in the last decade, though of course that does not account for inflation.

$1,000 in 2015 is equivalent in purchasing power to about $1,349.27 today, an increase of $349.27 over 10 years. So increasing the budget by 50% is an increase of only 15% or so. However visitation has more than doubled in that time, so the story is much worse. A 15% increase in $$ can not accommodate over a 100% in visitation. As someone who has been visiting NPS sites for over 40 years, the difference in care is striking.

 

[tlmgcamp1]

In 2023, the National Park Service contributed $55.6 billion to the U.S. economy, while its budget was $3.6 billion. This indicates a significant positive economic impact of the parks, far exceeding the

In 2023, the National Park Service contributed $55.6 billion to the U.S. economy, while its budget was $3.6 billion. This indicates a significant positive economic impact of the parks, far exceeding the direct funding they receive. It is possible that eliminating significant staff will result in lower service that discourages visitors which is likely to reduce the Park Service's economic contribution. It's like saving money by not paying to maintain your tow vehicle. Short term savings resulting in much higher long term costs.

When a politician wants some self-promotion, one way they do it is to put forth a bill to do something good that will also create jobs, all on the taxpayer's tab. Following your TV maintenance analogy, it would be a bill to reimburse dealerships to provide a maintenance plan with every vehicle they sell. This would make cars last longer, reduce pollution by keeping engines in top running condition, increase safety by making sure brakes/lights/etc are all in proper working order. Further, it will create new mechanic and data entry jobs. This all sounds great. How could anybody be upset with this? After all, the government is reimbursing all costs.

Then you look at the details and see that it requires the car to be brought to the dealer once a month to go through a 250 point inspection and oil change. It also requires a full engine rebuild and brake replacement every 10000 miles. Naturally, all this information will need to go into some new government database so it can be monitored and fines can be doled out for non-compliance.

Now someone comes along and proposes to cut that program because it is waste by way of paying for something that doesn't need to be done. At that point the opposition goes ballistic saying how trimming back the program will cause lay-offs for the mechanics and data entry people, accelerate climate change due to the cars that will be belching blue smoke. and kill thousands of people because of unsafe vehicles on the road.

There is a bit of sarcasm here, but not as much as you would hope. I deal with infrastructure grants every day and this scenario isn't that far off.

 

[Isaac-1]

tlmgcamp1 has a good point here about government efficiency, grants, etc. My wife works for a local government agency, after we were hit by 2 major hurricanes in 2020, they were given a FEMA grant to install a standby generator as they are part of what is deemed local critical disaster response infrastructure. This is now almost the start of the 2025 hurricane season, guess what they still don't have due to paperwork, government delays, etc., though there may be light at the end of the tunnel, if the money for the program is not cut, maybe just maybe they will get the authorization to purchase the generator before much longer, of course it was all priced based on bids received in 2021, which are no longer valid, so that will start another whole process, probably eventually involving paying the difference out of pocket.

 

[Domo]

In the midst of the turmoil, and without even trying for a political swipe or grandstand, it dawns on me that as users of the park system and respectful human beings, there are many things we could (should) be doing to ease any burden on any system: clean up well when leaving a site, pick up trash while walking FIDO or getting our 10,000 steps completed, make sure our trashbag gets INTO the bin, help others to set up without damage to the site and much more.

Anyone have other ideas of how we can easily help us all?

Heck, I remember walking the dog picking up trash and then showing all the randomly collected trash to other camper's kids (yes, under the watchful eye of a parent) and showing/telling them how others have trashed THEIR national park. Maybe they understood? That same concept applies pretty much everywhere.

Maybe I'm getting old and maudlin or just remember what I was taught when a brat.

 

[old RV guy]

In the midst of the turmoil, and without even trying for a political swipe or grandstand, it dawns on me that as users of the park system and respectful human beings, there are many things we could (should) be doing to ease any burden on any system: clean up well when leaving a site, pick up trash while walking FIDO or getting our 10,000 steps completed, make sure our trashbag gets INTO the bin, help others to set up without damage to the site and much more.

Anyone have other ideas of how we can easily help us all?

Heck, I remember walking the dog picking up trash and then showing all the randomly collected trash to other camper's kids (yes, under the watchful eye of a parent) and showing/telling them how others have trashed THEIR national park. Maybe they understood? That same concept applies pretty much everywhere.

Maybe I'm getting old and maudlin or just remember what I was taught when a brat.

Nice try, but when you repeat a talking point you heard on affirmation television ( post #3) you don't get to pretend any contrasting point is a political swipe. Best way to avoid politics is don't engage in politics.

 

[Domo]

Nice try, but when you repeat a talking point you heard on affirmation television ( post #3) you don't get to pretend any contrasting point is a political swipe. Best way to avoid politics is don't engage in politics.

Huh? I'm sorry things cause so much anger for you.

 

[garyb1st]

It's just like a Real Estate transaction. Convince Californians that the price of gas will be $8.50 a gallon in 2026 because they've shuttered refineries. Then see what they're will to accept for lower gas prices. Maybe a couple of new refineries or a bit more drilling and extraction of that liquid gold. Kinda like the Tarif Games currently being played. Threaten big, then negotiate.

 

[old RV guy]

Huh? I'm sorry things cause so much anger for you.

Another tactic is to propose anyone who calls me out must be angry, or suffering a derangement syndrome of some kind or another.

 

[old RV guy]

It's just like a Real Estate transaction. Convince Californians that the price of gas will be $8.50 a gallon in 2026 because they've shuttered refineries. Then see what they're will to accept for lower gas prices. Maybe a couple of new refineries or a bit more drilling and extraction of that liquid gold. Kinda like the Tarif Games currently being played. Threaten big, then negotiate.

How this is working, you're getting mugged, the robber takes your wallet then gives you back $20.00 and he just did you a favor.