2nd home

[GregFleetwoodFlair1991]

Hi all,
Have been asked to introduce myself...
As the username suggests, my name is Greg and I have a Fleetwood Flair.
Based in the UK, there are not many of these around and advice is hard to find here.
I have tasks to do on the RV from replacing the roof and sourcing a new overhead bed to fixing the gas heater and fridge.
Hope to get stuck in to them soon and will be asking all you nice RV'ers to help me out when the time comes.
That's all for now.
Best wishes,
Greg.

 

[Tom]

Hi Greg and welcome to The RV Forum. Which part of the UK are you in?

 

[GregFleetwoodFlair1991]

Thanks Tom,

I am in the Northwest, not far from Liverpool.

I take it you either get up very early in the morning or are also in the UK?

 

[Tom]

Hi Greg,

I'm originally from the UK (not-so-sunny South Wales), but have lived in the U.S. over 30 years. I'm online all hours, but on holidays this week.

 

[GregFleetwoodFlair1991]

Hi Tom,
Don't blame you for moving, we are always complaining (as you must know) about the weather.
Do you have any knowledge on the 110v/240v issue over here?
The van has a work site type step down for when hooked up but when we are using the generator, only the 110v sockets are live.
I was thinking of adding another step up converter to run form the generator to power the 240v sockets.
I am pretty good with home electrics but have no idea if the generator will be ok powering a 1000w step up transformer.
Please forgive me if this post is in the wrong place!
Best wishes.
Greg

 

[Tom]

Greg,

What size is the generator in your Flair (how many watts)? I suspect it's more than adequate to power 1000W.

The one thing I'd be concerned about is having a foolproof way of ensuring that the 240V sockets aren't connected to the step-up transformer from the generator at the same time as being powered from the (240V) mains. You didn't mention if your 240V sockets are 'live' when the Flair is plugged into mains over there; If not, then my concern would be a non-issue.

Just an FYI we have a couple of articles in our forum library describing what some Brits have done to make their US-built RV work in the UK. You're already one step ahead, having the step-down transformer to power the 110V stuff. The two articles are here and here, albeit somewhat redundant.

No problem with posting in the "wrong place"; Forum staff split and move discussions daily, and I might do that with this discussion.

 

[Ernie n Tara]

Just a quick note; its rare to have to replace a roof, as opposed to recoating it.  There have been several recent discussions on the subject here. I'd use the SEARCH function to view them before embarking on the replacement.

Ernie

 

[GregFleetwoodFlair1991]

Hi Tom,
Thanks for the links, will give them a read. The generator is an Onan Emerald 4000w (with a loud exhaust which is another job)
I was going to place an isolator on the internal ring. In 1 position it will connect the internal socket ring to the main power in (hookup) cable and in position 2 it will connect the ring to the 110v>240v step up which will be powered by the 110v generator so the ring can only be connected to one item at once.

Hi Ernie
Thanks for that, someone has covered with a rubber like coating which feels soft in places. I have read the best thing to do is pull back and investigate the soft areas. I thought as I had to do that, I would put it back to how (I assume) it used to be with a fiberglass top painted in the same colour as the rest of the RV. Any further advise is welcome.

Best wishes.
Greg.

 

[captsteve]

Your Flair likely came with a rubber roof. You can cut out sections if there is a drastic need for repairs of the underlying roof. There are great products available to put it back together. Then a recoat and you should be set.

 

[Tom]

I was going to place an isolator on the internal ring.

That would work just fine Greg, provided there's no possibility the two sources can be connected at the same time, even momentarily.

Just curious, are the 240V sockets actually connected in a ring? I know that's normal for house wiring in the UK (or used to be when I wired houses), but they may just be 'daisy chained' in the RV. How many 240 V sockets are there? The answers don't affect your plan, just wanting to satisfy a curiosity.

 

[Tom]

... are the 240V sockets actually connected in a ring?

One way to confirm that would be to look at the wires connected to the breaker (or fuse) for that circuit; If it's wired as a ring main (aka ring circuit), there will be two 'hot' (aka 'live') wires connected to the breaker/fuse, whereas only on hot/live wire would suggest they're daisy-chained (aka connected as a radial circuit). I only mention this because, if a ring main, both 'live' wires to the ring would need to be connected via the new isolator.

 

[GregFleetwoodFlair1991]

Hi there,
Thanks for the info on the roof, will mark out the soft areas with chalk and see what % that is of the roof and go from there.
Not sure on the socket connection method (assumed ring) there are about 6 x 240v sockets.
2 of them are on separate trips (marked satellite) located at the front over cab.
Thanks for the heads up though, I will check them out before doing anything and report back.
In the mean time, I have been looking at replacing the Generator altogether with a 240v one.
If I do this, I will probably connect it to a socket within the eternal hook up box and when not hooked up, I can simply plug the lead into the socket effectively plugging the RV into itself to run on the gen! That being the case, there is no way they can even be momentarily connected at the same time. (Again, thanks or that advice) The current Onan Genset Emerald 4000 is very noisy. I have looked at new exhausts and the are ?100. Are these usually ok as far as you know or would you put the ?100 towards a new 240v generator and fit it inside the generator housing within the RV? I know I would have to remove the battery and the fuel tank and connect them to the RV (and the remote start switch) but they are only about ?500 and I would save myself the step up inverter cost of ?90 in the process.
Decisions decisions!
Many thanks,
Greg.

 

[Tom]

I have been looking at replacing the Generator altogether with a 240v one. If I do this, I will probably connect it to a socket within the eternal hook up box and when not hooked up, I can simply plug the lead into the socket effectively plugging the RV into itself to run on the gen! That being the case, there is no way they can even be momentarily connected at the same time.

That would definitely be a foolproof system, at the expense of the small inconvenience of having to plug in.

The current Onan Genset Emerald 4000 is very noisy. I have looked at new exhausts and the are ?100. Are these usually ok ...

I'm a bit surprised that the Onan generator is very noisy. I don't know what the additional back-pressure from a new exhaust (I assume you mean 'silencer' in UK terms, or 'muffler' in US terms) would do. Maybe one of our mechanical experts (we affectionately call them 'gearheads') will jump in.

I know nothing about generators available in the UK today; What brands are they, and do you know they'll be quieter. Were it not for your 'very noisy' comment, I'd think that replacing a working generator might a little extreme, but having a 240V generator would seem to simplify things, given the fact you already have the 240V/110V step-down transformer.

Wish I could be more helpful.

 

[GregFleetwoodFlair1991]

Hi Tom,
Thanks for your reply.
I have done a little more research into standard generators and I am no longer sure it's the best option.
Did you know that 99% of generators need to be perfectly flat (level ground) to operate? And that they need 1 meter clearance all round for cooling?
Considering the Onan can be (I have read, please correct of I am wrong) ran while the RV is in motion, a replacement standard generator will be very restrictive. (A thought for anyone else who is thinking of this as a solution).
Finally, yes, sorry, I refer to the muffler.
Best wishes,
Greg.

 

[Tom]

... the Onan can be (I have read, please correct of I am wrong) ran while the RV is in motion ...

Correct, and many folks here run their generators while underway in order to power the air conditioning. We do the same thing on our boat.

 

[Charlie 5320]

I've been on the roof of a few Fleetwood made coachs, and to me they do seem soft, if you are not on the cross braces. They showed no signs of leaking on the inside. A good friend bought a 96 Storm last fall, and it is much softer than any coachs I've owned. It doesn't leak, and doesn't have any signs of ever leaked in the past. The roof on my Challenger is much more solid feeling. Does your coach show signs of leaking?

 

[GregFleetwoodFlair1991]

Hi Tom,
I thought as much, seems like a standard generator is not going to do the job. Will keep you posted.

Hi 92GA,
Thanks for the info, only leak I can find is the right hand (passenger) window but its very hard to see how its getting in. I drips from the part of the windows that slides open.

Another quick question for anyone... The instructions to the heater say to turn on the gas, turn the heating controller on the wall to ON and turn up the heat setting and you should have blown hot air.. I have done tis and nothing happens. Is there a pilot light I need to light? The one on the outside I assume is for hot water only?

Many thanks,

Greg.

 

[Tom]

Greg,

We have an excellent Furnace Troubleshooting Guide in our forum library that will help you diagnose issues with your heating system.

 

[GregFleetwoodFlair1991]

Hi Tom,
That information was great. I have now discovered the real issue thanks to that document.
Now then... the real issue is that the leisure battery does not charge when driving the vehicle.
Both the engine and leisure batteries are new but only the engine battery is charging when the engine is running.
It's only by hook up I can get power to charge the leisure battery.
What I need to know is, shouldn't the engine be charging both batteries and do the both charge form the same charger, (i.e. alternator)
Many thanks, I would be stuck without your posts.
Best wishes.
Greg.

 

[Tom]

Greg, different manufacturers, models and model years mean there is no real standard. Our 2003 Monaco Camelot charges the house batteries (aka leisure batteries) from the engine alternator, but only after the chassis batteries (aka starting batteries) have reached a preset level of charge. Our prior (1985) Pace Arrow (by Fleetwood) only charged the house batteries when plugged in to shore power.

Maybe someone else with a Flair can tell us if the house batteries are charged by the alternator. Have you checked the owners manual(s) to see if this is mentioned? What year is your Flair?