DEAD TOAD AFTER TOWING - WHAT DID WE DO WRONG NOW??????

[MikeandShirley]

We got to the RV park last night and went to unhook the toad and it was dead!  We just can't think of anything we did wrong - EXCEPT, that I was checking NEBA (neutral, emergency brake off, accessories) and Mike asked if the clock was always on.  Well, I couldn't remember.  So, I turned the key just ever so gently to the left to shut off the LED display of the clock.  Also, we locked the doors with the key remote.  Never locked it before, but heard at the convention that we should, so we did.

Called Coach-net and they came and jumped it and it's fine.  But it's certainly mind-boggling as we've never had a problem with any of that.

 

[jim and di]

MikeandShirley
I had my Buick fo dead after a 12 hour day and a fair amount of hills so the BrakeBuddy  was working. I installed a toad charger so the battery is always fully charged now. Good luck and enjoy the road.
JIm,

 

[vectra ed]

I tow a Honda Odyssey behind my Vectra.  I go through the gears and let it run for at least five minutes in neutral.  I then turn off the car but leave the key on accessory.  I also do this procedure about every 3 to 4 hours (easy when I stop for fuel.)  I never have a problem.  Good traveling.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

There is always some power draw on the toad battery, so if the battery is nearing the end of its life it may just be weak and tired. That's an '06, right? Still the original battery?

If you have the type of toad brake that actuates the brake pedal in some fashion, the toad's own brake lights come on each time. That is some battery load right there. Clock, ECM, radio memory, controller for the power door locks, etc. All suck a little juice form the battery while towing.

 

[sheltie]

We got to the RV park last night and went to unhook the toad and it was dead!  We just can't think of anything we did wrong - EXCEPT, that I was checking NEBA (neutral, emergency brake off, accessories) and Mike asked if the clock was always on.  Well, I couldn't remember.  So, I turned the key just ever so gently to the left to shut off the LED display of the clock.  Also, we locked the doors with the key remote.  Never locked it before, but heard at the convention that we should, so we did.

Called Coach-net and they came and jumped it and it's fine.  But it's certainly mind-boggling as we've never had a problem with any of that.

I have the same Toad as you and the only thing I do that you didn't mention - and it's very important - is remove the 30A fuse in the fuse box.  Also, I don't drive over 65, redo the process after no more than seven hours, etc.  Check your Vue manual to confirm what I've written and it may help you.

 

[MikeandShirley]

We do remove the fuse.  We do everything the manual and Roadmaster says to do.  We hook up the roadmaster, hook up the brake system, pull the fuse, pump the brakes several times, put it in neutral, take off the emergency brake, put the key on accessories.  Then turn it on and run it for 3 minutes every 7 hours, et al.  Mostly we wonder if others find that when they turn the key to accessories, does your dash light up with all the LED displays or just your clock or nothing at all?  This was the only difference except we did lock the doors with the remote this time.

 

[John From Detroit]

What breaking system do you use and how far did you tow it?

Many braking systems use the power stored in the towed's battery to operate the braking system.  No matter how many times people tell me these do not cause issues... Well. fact is if you don't run the towed's engine or otherwise charge the battery.. THEY WILL (Any ongoing load will and these systems present a multiple amp load)

The average starting battery is well under 100 amp hours (70ish is common) and you can only use about 25 percent and expect the vehicle to start.. Might go deeper if the ride starts real easy.  Many of the easier starting cars the battery is even smaller.


Now.. that said.. There is a solution

It is called a "Towed charge" system, and it's an add on for your motor home and towed.  Kind of like the Trick-L-Start for motor homes but this one works on the towed.

Uses the motor home alternator to charge the towed's battery when towing.

The US-Gear Unified Brake system.. Includes this feature.

 

[MikeandShirley]

We have an air braking system - Roadmaster system, and the tow bar is the Demco brand.

We did travel from 11 a.m. until 6:30 p.m. and we were in two traffic jams, one in Sandy, OR and the other in Chehalis, WA.  This put an extra two hours on our trip from Redmond, OR to Olympia, WA.  So, perhaps just the long haul w/o charging the toad's battery is what the issue was.

 

[sheltie]

We do remove the fuse.  We do everything the manual and Roadmaster says to do.  We hook up the roadmaster, hook up the brake system, pull the fuse, pump the brakes several times, put it in neutral, take off the emergency brake, put the key on accessories.  Then turn it on and run it for 3 minutes every 7 hours, et al.  Mostly we wonder if others find that when they turn the key to accessories, does your dash light up with all the LED displays or just your clock or nothing at all?  This was the only difference except we did lock the doors with the remote this time.

Hmmm, can't see anything you did wrong.  I rarely lock the car when towing, so I don't remember if the dash lights up or not.  I have used the remote several times but have never had a problem.  I'm pretty sure that the dash does light up but I don't know about the clock.  I know that the time is correct after seven hours, but lit or not I have know idea.  Sorry I couldn't help.

 

[John From Detroit]

We have an air braking system - Roadmaster system, and the tow bar is the Demco brand.

We did travel from 11 a.m. until 6:30 p.m. and we were in two traffic jams, one in Sandy, OR and the other in Chehalis, WA.  This put an extra two hours on our trip from Redmond, OR to Olympia, WA.  So, perhaps just the long haul w/o charging the toad's battery is what the issue was.

Are you talking about the Roadmaster "Even Brake" system.. One of the systems I call a "Brake in a box"

Yes it uses compressed air to press the pedal.. The car's battery is what compresses the air..  Your drive was not too long but that traffic jam likely put a lot of strain on the system.  And thus that is what likely killed the battery.

Another possible cause is a fault with the vehicle electrical system.. But I've not seen that often. (once in fact)

 

[taoshum]

if, and it's only an "if",  the brake system has an air leak somewhere, the compressor would run more than normal; or if you were in stop 'n go traffic for a while the compressor might have run more than normal leading to extra loads on the battery.  I'd probably charge the battery and try it again and verify that something is draining the battery...?  with and without the remote door locks?  On some vehicles, when you lock using the remote, the "security system" comes on and monitors the doors for an intruder.    If you lock it using the key in the door, the old fashioned way, it doesn't turn on the "security system".  I won't tell the story of how I learned this...it's not pleasant.  If the "security system" triggered, the horn starts making noise and maybe some other stuff... that could run the battery down even faster.  I suppose you'd hear it though if the horn started blowing.

You could get a battery turnoff switch to save the battery... if all else fails.

 

[mrschwarz]

I have the 2007 version of the Vue. Are you sure you removed the correct fuse? If I remember correctly, if the fuse is removed, the clock should be off. Also, if you have the compass and temp in the rear view mirror, it should be off, too.

 

[tswms]

I have a 7 Saturn Ion (not a Vue) My instruction calls for removing the #40 Fuse. I have gone as long as 4 days and was still able to start the Tad. I use a Brake Buddy Classic.

 

[rsalhus]

I have a 7 Saturn Ion (not a Vue) My instruction calls for removing the #40 Fuse. I have gone as long as 4 days and was still able to start the Tad. I use a Brake Buddy Classic.

Your 2007 Saturn Ion must be different from ours.  Our towing instructions call for removing the IP BATT 2 fuse, which is fuse #41 and is a 40 Amp fuse.  The trouble is, removing the BATT 2 fuse disables the two 12V power outlets needed by my Blue Ox Apollo Braking System.  Not only that, but it also disables the ION's brake lights, radio and clock, wipers, ignition key buzzer, odometer light, dome light, ignition (you can't start the car with this fuse removed), and more that I haven't discovered yet.

Our 2007 Saturn Ion Manual shows that fuse #40 is for the Anti-lock Brake System and/or the Traction Control Module.  And all engines for the Ion, the 2.2L L4, 2.0 L4, and the 2.4L LE5 all use fuses #40 and #41 in the same manner.

 

[Ken & Sheila]

Mike & Shirley,
We have a 2006 Saturn Vue (V6, AWD). We also use the brakemaster (air cylinder).

I have toad the Vue for several days without unhitching. I do run it after 7 hrs and first thing in the morning on the second, third day. I did not have a charging wire on the Windsor. I have never had a problem with it not have a good charge when we were done towing it.

I can't answer your question about the dash lights because this trip we are towing our Liberty. I will be back in Phoenix next weekend and can check the Vue.

ken

 

[tswms]

My error, it is #41 (IP, Batts) 40 is ABS.  Disables dash, and all power asc including locks.I lock while towing and have to manualy lock drivers door.

 

[rsalhus]

My error, it is #41 (IP, Batts) 40 is ABS.  Disables dash, and all power asc including locks.I lock while towing and have to manualy lock drivers door.

You must not use the 12V power receptacles for the Brake Buddy because pulling fuse #41 disables both of them in our Saturn.  I leave the fuse in and use both receptacles when towing.  I do run the Saturn a few minutes after towing it all day.  It works for me.

 

[tswms]

I do use the console power port. It is live with the fuse pulled. I have never checked the rear one.
I normaly use the rear for Garmin since it is controled by the ignition switch. When towing I move tyhe Garmin to the MH.

 

[MikeandShirley]

Thanks everyone!  I think we've realized that it was the long day and traffic jams that did the deed!  Thanks for all your help.

 

[rsalhus]

I do use the console power port. It is live with the fuse pulled. I have never checked the rear one.

You're right, the console power receptacle is live when fuse #41 is pulled but the rear receptacle is not.  I tested it today.  Also when you pull fuse #41, the rear brake lights won't light when the Brake Buddy applies the brakes.  No big deal, I guess, as long as they work when the towing vehicle applies the brakes. 

Also, all the interior lights including all the lights around the dash won't work with fuse #41 pulled.  I'm sure you know that you do still have to turn the ignition key to ACC to unlock the steering wheel whether fuse #41 is pulled or not.

Thanks everyone!  I think we've realized that it was the long day and traffic jams that did the deed!  Thanks for all your help.

Mike, I tend to think that if your dash lights were on, you either pulled the wrong fuse or didn't pull the right fuse.  Unless you checked the dash lights after turning rthe key to ACC but before pulling the fuse.