Don't want to kill my 2015 F150 5.0! 8000 lbs?

[Ned]

Is it normal to have nearly a 3000 lb difference between dry weight and GVWR?

It's called the Cargo Carrying Capacity.  From the forum glossary:

CCC (Cargo Carrying Capacity):
There are two legal definitions of CCC (Cargo Carrying Capacity), depending on the date of the certificate showing the value.

Prior to June 2, 2008, the RVIA standard weight label defined CCC as follows:

CCC or Cargo Carrying Capacity is equal to GVWR (see listing) minus UVW (see listing) plus the weight of fresh water in the tank and hot water heater, the weight of propane in the tank, and the SCWR (see listing). For the mathematically inclined:

CCC = GWVR - (UVW + SCWR + Propane + Water)

UVW is the actual dry weight of the RV.  See the glossary for more definitions.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

There are numerous places to weigh. Landfills is one possibility, but so are sand & gravel yards, moving van companies, many truck stops, grain elevators, large feed & fertilizer supplies, etc. The CAT Scales wen site will identify the nearest truck stop with a CAT Scale.

You want a place and/or time-of-day that isn't too busy, so you can weigh truck and trailer separately without hassle. Also tell them you do NOT need a certified weight (no official certificate issued). That's usually cheaper.

 

[jnbettes]

Amazing how much I have learned in the last week about this stuff. Look forward to see how the family adjusts. Right now we're letting some of our ideas get out of hand. Will be interesting to see where we are in a year fron now.  We are even fantasizing about selling our house and buying a 20k lb 5th wheel and living in it.  Taking kids out of school, work remote, etc. Right now the idea sounds awesome!  I do think I'm going to have to get a new truck. Will certainly be able to tell next friday when we tow for the first time.

 

[Frizlefrak]

So on my drive back from Virginia, I have located two Dodge dealers.  Both are working numbers for me right now for a 6.70L Cummins I6 Turbodiesel 4x4.  Sticker price is the exact same as the Ecoboost.  If either can come close to the deal Ford was offering for the Ecoboost, I will probably pull in and switch trucks.  I'll have 2 days to test the rig out.  Pick up on Friday, stay a few nights at some local camp sites, then drive home.  I suppose I can at least fill up the water tank and find some other heavy things to weigh in down and then go look for some hills to climb.

Once you've pulled with a Cummins, you'll throw rocks at any of the gas trucks, including the Ecoboost. 

My trailer is nearly 8000 lbs, and my 2014 2500 Cummins barely knows it's back there, even pulling steep grades.  And it gets a consistent 14 mpg towing in New Mexico, which means lots of mountains.  Empty it gets close to 20 mpg on the highway.  If you're careful and don't check every option known to mankind, you can get one for a decent price.  Mine was $46,700 out the door.  It's a Tradesman, but has all the usual power goodies, dual alternators (440 amp charging), electronic shift on the fly 4X4, backup camera, integrated trailer brake controller, connectivity package with voice recognition, chrome package, XM, Bluetooth, Class IV hitch, and of course, Cummins power.  What it doesn't have is heated seats and steering wheel, HVAC controllers in the radio (which I detest), leather that my butt sticks to in 105 degree weather, and silly looking faux wood trim.  It's a purpose built vehicle and does it's job nicely.  It's still just as quiet in the cabin and refined as the Laramie....wifey loves driving it....as do I.  And it manhandles my 30' trailer.

 

[Mopar1973Man]

Once you've pulled with a Cummins, you'll throw rocks at any of the gas trucks, including the Ecoboost. 

I agree ^^^^

I'm also a 2002 Dodge Cummins owner but modified my 13 year old truck to perform like the new 2015 in power. (400 HP / 900 FT/LBS) I can pull all the grades here in Idaho which includes 16-20% grade for forestry roads. As for fuel mileage I can reach mid 20's empty and low teens pulling the 8,000 pound 31 foot trailer. No issues at all. I'm at 244k miles now and still going strong. Cummins diesels are built to last a very long time and rarely fail. As for capacity of pulling even my truck is rated for 13,400 pound trailer or 20,000 GCWR. Not bad for 3/4 ton truck. 

To be fair I'm also a V8 gasser owner. I have a 1996 Dodge 1500 Ram which is OK for light duty towing. But I'd never tow a RV with a 1/2 ton truck.

 

[jnbettes]

I've spent every day working with 3 dealerships.  2 for the ram, one for the F250 (as well as backup plan for F150 for Ecoboost).  I have struck out with everyone!  The Rams came in a high for me.  So I go back to Ford.  F250 I could do but they were trying to give me an ugly work truck so I passed.  By time I get back to Ecoboost, they said the deal was gone.  I've bought so many vehicles through these guys that I've never considered looking at other Ford places.  So I'm reaching out to one more dealership to look into a 2014 Ecoboost.  If this don't work, then I'll be forced to weigh everything before I throw it into the trailer.  A bit frustrating few days!  I walked away from a deal I should've taken last Friday.  Maybe I'll get something better with this new dealership.  Or maybe I'll just drive down the road in my current truck with my flashers on?!

Still on track to get the RV though! 

 

[Mopar1973Man]

Maybe you should consider used trucks? At least I know the 1998.5 to 2002 Dodge Ram with Cummins diesels will clear 1 MILLION Miles. So anything below that is low miles. I'm currently at 244k miles just made it to the moon and turning around to come home.

 

[jnbettes]

Ended up with the ecoboost 3.5L  and 3.55 rear axel.  Towes  beautifully!  Only has a 1/3 tank of water. Not sure why they had it in. I was hoping for closer to 12 mpg but coming in at a solid 10 mpg.  Kinda sucks but nothing I can do now.

 

[Frizlefrak]

You'll like the Ecoboost a whole lot better than the 5.0.  BTW....I wouldn't complain about 10 mpg towing with a gasser....my old 460 got 8 mpg pulling.  My Cummins only gets 14 pulling a similar load, but of course that's including pulling a lot of steep mountain grades.

 

[jnbettes]

There were some long hills as we made it home. Came in at 9.7 mpg.  When I budget for drive out west I'm going to plan for 9. 

My dad came with me as he has more towing experience and he was impressed as well.  just to see what I'm missing, I want to see how a diesel pulls this exact same TT.  Would be interesting to see.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

The economy advantage of a small engine is lost when towing or otherwise heavily loaded. Sometimes they will even get worse mpg than a larger engine under those same conditions. It takes a lot of horsepower to move a heavy load that also displaces a lot of air as it moves. And horsepower takes fuel to generate it. There is no way around those basics.

Be thankful it will turn in pretty good numbers when NOT towing.

The diesel advantage is that it extracts a lot more energy from a gallon of fuel and keeps the rpms low so that friction losses are minimized. However, it still has to generate the aforementioned horsepower to do the job. No free lunch - just a bit better efficiency under those conditions.

 

[jnbettes]

My first 30 minutes of driving I was convinced I had made a mistake!!  First, I took a wrong turn as I was not able to perform a uturn as the GPS requested.  This was a small town so the road I turned down had no parking lots or enough space to turn around so I just kept going.  I lost service on my cell which meant I lost GPS.  My truck told me I was driving south so I just kept going!  The roads were horrible which ended up shaking me (physically, not mentally) quite a bit.  I had one tire on the yellow line (center) and one tire on the white (shoulder) and very little room for error.  Started to rain pretty hard.  Showing about 6mpg for first few minutes which also had me freaked out!  Again, was thinking in my head, what have I done!!

Finally, went far enough south to get service again, sun came out, roads were maintained and even made it to the Interstate!  At that point, I was cruising with a smile.  Oh yeah, almost side swiped a fuel pump.  I saw it coming and saw I would clear it by a few inches so I really wouldn't have hit it.  But the trailer did not act quite like I thought it would when I turned in.  I'm glad my dad came with me instead of my wife as my wife may have been freaking out worse than me about the whole mistake thing.  I can now fake like an experienced driver when she gets in the truck for the first time with me which will be later today for a short drive to Lake Lanier in GA. 

Kids are outside in it right now.  I'm honestly very excited about the potential here.  I just have to turn off that thing in my head that says every trip I go I'll be averaging 9-10 mpg.  I'm hoping for a small weekend trip once a month and 2-3 longer trips to the beach or Disney area (6-8 hours).  And then one trip to Montana every 2-4 years, first one being this July.  In 2-4 years, I may have that Ram 2500 Diesel by then! 

 

[Mopar1973Man]

Just comparing using my local fuel price (Riggins, ID) I inputed my current MPG for my diesel and swapped the 1996 (1500 Ram) for your value on the loaded section. Now looking at prices and MPG difference. Worlds cheaper on a diesel even though the price is higher. My truck crosses the scales loaded at 8,020 pounds and nearly 17,000 pound combined.

Remember my truck is heavily modified (400 horse power / 900 foot pounds of torque). Quite a bit more power that that little eco-boost.

 

[Molaker]

Just comparing using my local fuel price (Riggins, ID) I inputed my current MPG for my diesel and swapped the 1996 (1500 Ram) for your value on the loaded section. Now looking at prices and MPG difference. Worlds cheaper on a diesel even though the price is higher. My truck crosses the scales loaded at 8,020 pounds and nearly 17,000 pound combined.

Remember my truck is heavily modified (400 horse power / 900 foot pounds of torque). Quite a bit more power that that little eco-boost.

Too late Mopar1973Man.  He's already bought an ecoboost. Now all he needs to do is relax and enjoy it and quit worrying about what "coulda been".

 

[Mopar1973Man]

Well now he knows the mistakes of market hype and he'll learn from this experience. 

 

[jnbettes]

Well now he knows the mistakes of market hype and he'll learn from this experience. 

You sound like my father in law,  which is not a bad thing!  I can assure you it was not a mistake.  There's always a more powerful truck. Just like there's always a better year for a mopar.  I had a '70.    I passed the wife test as well. All is good in the world.

 

[jnbettes]

I also want whoever has an f150, 3.5L, 3.55 rear axel ecoboost (that can tow 9600 lbs according to ford specs) know that you can make this work.  You just have to be ok with 9-10 mpg.  It tows great. Does it tow better than a diesel, of course not.  A few diesels would work as my daily driver but it would slightly increase fuel costs due to both vehicles getting in the same range of miles per gallon.  Also diesel where I am located is the same price as premium.  however, when I'm towing a heavy load with the ecoboost I would obviously lose that very small advantage by close to 4-5 mpgs.  I'm not lost at this point on where I'm at today. The only problem is, I just couldn't do the diesel considering I do not buy used due to past experience. One guy may get a million miles while I may find myself with a broke down diesel after a 100k miles.  So again, happy, TT & ecoboost owner.  Most grateful for the one to be within the 20% margin. That turned into my goal. 

 

[Mopar1973Man]

A few diesels would work as my daily driver but it would slightly increase fuel costs due to both vehicles getting in the same range of miles per gallon.  Also diesel where I am located is the same price as premium.

Again that is not exactly true. I work on diesel trucks for living. Most people get low to mid 20's for empty truck if setup right and driven correctly. So the price per gallon looks high but cost per mile is still much cheaper than gas power vehicles.

 

[Frizlefrak]

From a Cummins owner...

I use my truck almost exclusively for towing.  I drive it to work and back once a week to keep it exercised (25 mile round trip).  When a diesel is in its element, nothing can beat it.  That said, if I was using the truck 90% as a daily driver and 10% for towing, I'd have bought a gasser.  Even 75/25, the gasser would have been a better choice.  While diesels pull better and get better fuel mileage, they are a bit cantankerous for every day driving.  Wait for glow plug light to go off to start, wait until exhaust gas temps are under 300 to shut it off (or 1-2 minutes without a pyrometer).  They aren't suited well to short trips.  And so on.

But with a heavy load pulling a steep grade, they are a blessing directly from above..... 

 

[jnbettes]

Again that is not exactly true. I work on diesel trucks for living. Most people get low to mid 20's for empty truck if setup right and driven correctly. So the price per gallon looks high but cost per mile is still much cheaper than gas power vehicles.

With my 5.0 I would get 18.  I don't know what I'll get with the ecoboost. I'm hoping for 20 but maybe it will be similar. If it's 20 and the diesel is stock, I'm not sure how I would be able to save anything. I'm going off of fuelly.com.  no personal experience with diesels. And very few with the ram show anything above 18.  Most show 16 - 18.  Not my research so can't claim this as fact. Just something on the world wide web. 

I hear what you're saying but numbers I see don't back it up and I had no buddies I could ask to convince me one way or the other. 

But as Frizlefrak stated, a lot of hoops to jump through for someone who could get the same job I need to get done on a daily basis while driving a Mazda 3. In fact, that was my car just 5 years ago before saying to hell with the price of gas and buying an f150.