How to access the coach blower motor

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Dean
I sure want to thank you for the great post. I will be one of the first to look at your photos when you post them. For now take a WELL deserved brake just for getting it out! On mine the engine hoses do not come out in the wheel well. Wish they did. The hoses stick out pointing forward & they are between the transmission and the floor making the two hoses almost impossible to get to even with the doghouse off. This kind of engeneering makes it so hard for a teck to fix it. How CAN he do a good job. He has to pull and stretch everything untill he gets it off. As for putting it back if he can just get it all back in he is thankfull.  Thanks for the correct info on the real problem that caused all this. I sure hope Winnebago is reading your post! Mine was under warrenty when it went bad. I should have had them repair it just to make them lose money so MAYBE they would fix the problem in later motor homes. Thanks Art
 
Dean, thanks for posting your work on the heater fan.  I am having the same problems with my heater and was just starting to research it when I came across your thread. I'll be racing Art to see your pics. Good job.

kl
 
Dean
I asume the part you are ordering is the burnt out resistor wire and not the motor. My first hint of trouble was all the smoke comming from the floor vents. The resistor normally can't be fixed because at the factory they install all that smoke that came out and there is no way I can put all that smoke back in that pigtale resistor wire!  What are you going to do to keep the fan blade on the shaft? Thanks Art
 
You are correct--the resistor is on order.  It never smoked that I noticed, but it isn't supplying the requisite power to the motor when Low is selected at the Coach Heater (CH) switch.  (I loosely reassembled the CH box so I could set it in place and connect it to its coach wiring harness for testing with the dash switch.)

After I put the washer on the motor shaft, I pushed the squirrel cage blower back on the shaft and reinstalled the coil spring around the end boss of the blower.  So, while the blower cannot rub on the motor any more, I suppose there is nothing but the "snug" fit aided by the pressure of the  coil spring to keep it from moving the other way.  That would be just great if, after all this, I put everything back together and the blower worked its way outboard until it rubbed on the housing or something in the other direction!  Maybe when I put the new resistor in, I'll put some goop on the end of the shaft for insurance.
 
Dean
I might suggest you take the squirrel cage to an appliance parts man & see if they have one in metal not plastic that has the set screw which you could RED LOCTIGHT the set screw in. I mention this as only you , me, and anyone who had done this job knows how hard it is to get to. If I had had the great knowledge about what actually caused this problem that you provided I would have taken the time while I had the water heater out to also figure a way to get mine out. This forum is great. Thanks to the folks that run it.  Oh I use a netbook with a small screen & just noticed if I scroll all the way down there is a SPELL CHECK!  In school I liked Math & Science, I thought spelling was OK till they tried to get me to spell newmonia  with a P that's when I said to myself Math & science makes much more sense. Art
 
Sorry, Art, the chance of finding a parts place and a part that fit, etc., just exceeds my old age tolerance!  I'd have to find a shaft that fit, a motor that had that shaft, a new housing, a new blower box, a new location, new ducting, a new floor, new chassis rails, a new chassis, a new coach, and a new DW!  Just keepin' the faith . . . .

Spell checker works good . . . oops, works well!
 
Dean
You would be real surprised with what the appliance parts store has. What is the shaft size and the squirrel cage size. We have a store here that has them hanging on the wall! I meant to only change the cage. They are not expensive. You have more info than us as you can see the plastic one. Do you think the plastic hub is stout enough to hold up. I have seen some plastic car squirrel cages crack in the centre then it would not turn at shaft speed. If you give me the size I will check down here in the south for you. Us Alabama hicks  can fix anything. Just wish my old body would coroperate. Art
 
Dean, in reading your posts it sounds as if there is no other possible way to remove the blower motor with out removing the water heater, is that correct? Do you think it would be possible to cut a larger opening in the side ducting/housing where the motor is? I really want to not pull the water heater out.  Any ideas?

kl
 
Art,
You are certainly right; I am surprised at what an appliance store has.  I couldn?t allocate time or gasoline to visit my local stores, but I googled ?appliance parts,? went to the first commercial site offered, and searched ?squirrel cage blower.?  It came up with 500 blowers, blower wheels, and related parts, some of which were probably in the ballpark!  But I think the OEM blower wheel (now I know the correct term) I have is well-built (albeit plastic; what the heck, our toad is plastic) and quite serviceable, including the hub with the strong metal spring wrapped around it for reinforcement.  The fact that it is not absolutely anchored to the shaft is a little bothersome, but it takes quite a firm push to move it and I haven?t heard any complaints of slippage in the forums.  To combat the possibility of outward migration on the shaft, I thoroughly cleaned the shaft tip yesterday and coated it with contact cement.  To get the shaft and blower wheel dimensions at this point would require another disassembly of the CH box and the blower housing.  I?ll do that to provide you with the dimensions for your personal use, if you insist, but not to have you go on some research project on my behalf.  I really appreciate your offer and support, though.

Kent,
I know exactly what you mean; the last thing I wanted to do was pull the WH.  I mean, I was determined.  I wriggled and twisted, and used a bench and some pillows, and my 8-year-old grandson, and I did manage to get a few of the coach heater box screws out.  But, as I mentioned on 8/14, all I could do was prop the one side open enough to catch a glimpse of the motor side of the blower assembly.  Even if I could have gotten the CH box loose (three screws to the floor, but one completely unreachable), I would not have been able to get it out to work on it.  A lot of time, frustration, and achy muscles got me nowhere in the end.  I reached in to take pictures, inspected under the coach, behind the front wheel, behind and beside the engine, removed the doghouse, but to no avail.  There are no access panels in any of these spots.  I also removed the front-most register from my floor distribution duct.  Reaching in there, I could lift the flapper door that opens into the duct when the blower is blowing, but even if I enlarged the register opening, as suggested elsewhere, I am now sure I couldn?t have achieved any fix from that end, either.  In my coach, my conclusion is that there is no way to get to the blower wheel and motor shaft without removing the WH.  It seemed impossible to me at the time, and it is taking lots of time, but the job is definitely doable.

Regarding cutting access panels, I only see one place for that (again, in my coach) which would have any benefit, but it would not get me access to the CH box and blower.  ?Troth,? in another forum, cut a rectangular opening under the back of the WH to provide access to valves he added back there and to serve as an inspection port for leaks (a good idea).  However, I am going to leave my compartment floor intact, and I am probably going to apply some foam insulation to it from underneath when everything else is finished.

I sense that you are anxious to access your blower.  As mentioned, I plan to delineate this whole procedure in detail with pictures, but that is still in the future, maybe a couple of weeks or more.  However, I have already written the introduction to that document, I have scads of pictures (over 120), and I can provide some docs from others I have corresponded with.  If you want any of that material in its present discombobulated state, I will make it available if you email me at [email protected].

Lastly (sorry about being so windy here),
While I still wait for parts (the resistor), I yesterday painted the part of the compartment floor where the WH sits; I put connectors in the wires to the compartment light; I removed most of the goo around the WH flange and restored the flange to its 90 degree position.  Today I?m thinking about readying some new heater hoses for the reinstallation.

Regards,
Dean
 
Dean
No need to take your unit apart just to get the wheel size. If you think the hub is strong enough that is good enough for me. I want to say thanks & congratulations on a job well done as you are the first to let us know what the REAL problem was! It sure is hidden in a NEET place! I would feel VERY safe hiding my money in there! No normal thief would ever work that hard to get into that space. Thanks Art
 
Much to my surprise, the resistor for the CH arrived in the mail today.  Unfortunately, I didn?t see the mail until 5 PM or so.  That means I wasted a whole afternoon pruning bushes and trees with my three-year-old granddaughter, LOL.  I coulda been installing and testing the new part and had a hot shower tonight!

Anyway, after putting in the new resistor, I loosely screwed the box together, placed it on its shelf, plugged it in, and presto, High and Low speed blower success.  So before dinner, I tightened all the screws in the box, installed foam weather-stripping in key places and got the box in place.  After dinner I secured it to its platform with its three screws and demonstrated the high/low airflow to the DW.  And that?s it for tonight!  Tomorrow we deal with heater hoses and getting the WH back in place . . . .
 
I forget if I had replied here or elsewhere. I got mine apart in place without removing the water heater. I left the heat exchanger hooked up, no coolant to mess with. Disassembled the box and reomved the motor and blower.

Wasn't easy. But I did it. And My 31Y is VERY tight. Slide ram is right there too.
 
My hat's off to you, ennored.  I have seen other reports of accessing the CH without WH removal, and, bless you, you even did it without disconnecting the heater hoses from the core.  I envy all those 5-er and TT guys who just open a cupboard or remove a drawer or something to have instant access to the back of their WHs.  But then they don't have CHs, do they?

As to the CH, it is all a matter of the individual coach layout, a thorough inspection of the location from all angles, and the ingenuity and agility of the mechanic.
 
Yesterday I made a parts run to get butyl rubber tape for the WH flange and some water heater hose and fittings, as I plan to lengthen the hoses to the WH in case it ever has to come out again.  So right now I?m in the middle of doing the heater hoses and getting the 120 VAC hooked up again.  Maybe we?ll have hot water by the end of the day!
 
Hi Ho:  It sounds like you guys are having too much fun.  The normal failure for the blower is that the bearing allows the squirrel cage to rub.  Be sure it turns freely and doesn't make a noise.  The rubbing can cause the dropping resistor to fail and just replacing the resistor will only last a short time.

Since you guys have everything apart there are two things that should be checked at the same time:  The first is to get rid of the one-way valves in the hot and cold water supply lines.  At least if you use compressed air to winterize, this is the easiest way to avoid failure.

The second is the check the power connections to the water heater.  They use Amp fast-ons on my unit and the incorrect size was used on one side.  This resulted in the wire burining out.  A fire is possible, but you need to fix the connection to get the electric water heater to work properly if you have this wiring error.

I'm sorry that we have been traveling and haven't seen your posts.  By the way, Alaska is great--6 weeks, and we just spent a week in Jackson Lake and Yellowstone for the upteenth time.  35 degrees at night and 75 in the daytime--not bad.  It is now about 100 degrees in Salt Lake City.

Dirk
 
Dirk
I found my two check valves had already destroyed themselves. One had the center part GONE so I removed what was left in the other one. They were plastic innerds. They had been in the broken open position so I did not notice any problem. I wonder where in my plumbing the other piece is?
  One Question? They way I understand Deans post it was not the bearing but the squerrel cage that moved in on its shaft  & rubbed onto the fan housing.  As I understand he put some washers to stop the squrrel cage from moving in on the shaft it is mounted on by the force of the spring on the outside. He sent me some very good photos of the end showing the spring. Do you have the same type as he does? If there is also a bearing problem in the motor I would like to know so I will fix the two problems at one time. 
  Sounds like Alaska is the place to be in this heat. Thanks in advance for your help. Art
 
Hi Ho:  I think you have found the problem.  If the motor runs free and nothing rubs I think you've got it.  Now if it will just stay that way.  I'm amazed that WI doesn't do something to solve the problem.  Anyway, it's been a couple of years since I had mine apart.  Good luck; let us know how it goes.

Dirk
 
Fun is right!  What a job!

My check valves (OEM, plastic) seemed to be okay and I have not heard any noises or found hot or cold water in the wrong places, so I did not change them.  There was evidence of a small amount of leakage from where the check valve screws into the hot outlet, so I re-taped that connection.  Likewise, with the check valves still in place, I have had no problem with the OEM water heater bypass, so it remains.  The 120V to the electric heater element proved to be done with sound wires and connectors, so that all went back in as it was (thanks, dirko).  I did lengthen the heater hoses to the motoraid, so now the WH can clear the compartment with them still attached.  As I worked the WH all the way back into place, when I was reconnecting the two fresh water connections, I started to wish I had followed one suggestion made to cut an access panel in the floor of the compartment at the back of the WH.  This would greatly improve making (or breaking) those final connections and inspecting for leaks.

So everything is reinstalled now and everything works!  I do have a little bit of sealing and foaming to do yet, but the hot water is flowing and the coach heater is blowing (on both speeds).

As mentioned before, I am going to organize my thoughts and procedures, along with a bunch of pictures into a single document, which I will make available here as soon as it is finished.
 
hdmox said:
As mentioned before, I am going to organize my thoughts and procedures, along with a bunch of pictures into a single document, which I will make available here as soon as it is finished.

Good job!  Sounds like a good article for the forum library!
 
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