How to use a class B

[Joenew61]

My wife and I are currently in the “research phase” looking at a soon to be post-retirement first purchase, with the intent of taking long cross country trips with a dog or two. Based on all the online research we have done, my original thought was to get a super C so as to have all onboard amenities and enough payload space. I have a couple of other threads here, and have really appreciated all the advice….yes we will rent first, and make sure the reality is as good as the “fantasy”. We still haven’t been able to see anything in person, but hope to schedule some time for that.

We were toying with the idea of potentially going in a different direction, in the event we couldn’t see ourselves living in the rig for a month or more at a time, or if there were any issues getting used to driving and managing such a large rig and toad etc. We were thinking perhaps getting a class B and arranging our trips to be a combination of RV parks with that, and hotels or other brick and mortar facilities as a change of pace. That would give us more options for tourism, some balance in terms of creature comforts and overall effort, but still give us some space for the dog (s), and the flexibility to be self-sufficient when necessary. I realize we would need to travel really light, and find pet friendly venues to stay in.

Does anyone use their class B like this, and is there anything else to consider or think about? Would trying to have a hybrid plan like this leave us half way to nowhere, or does it sound realistic?

Thanks!

 

[Mark_K5LXP]

The only advantages I see to a B is a tad easier to drive, and easier to find parking for. But they're not really any cheaper to buy and though the fuel mileage is better, it's not remarkable. So there's no easy answer. I know my DW puts a solid "no" to anything with a wet bath or a cassette toilet and it does seem like a lot of messing around to deal with that and the fresh/gray for the limited utility they provide. "Better than nothing" but for the price of admission the B's seem to only partially fill the gaps. I think you really need to experience the living space in a B. Three's a crowd in one of those and a dog is at least a "half". Who knows, maybe living with the bare essentials is just the thing to focusing on the trips and experience, and a B checks all those boxes for you. There's tons of you tube videos from people living in vans and B's to see what accommodations they've had to make for this to work. Of course now there's the "B Plus" but practically speaking they might as well be a class C once you start adding slides and a 20+ foot house. Frankly I don't see much advantage to having a class C either, unless having a shorter RV is a requirement. Acquiring and moving a large class C down the road is no less expensive or complicated than a class A, so why not have the A. No doubt there are a lot of B & C owners out there that will advise me in the error of my ways...

Mark B.
Albuquerque, NM

 

[SeilerBird]

A dog would not do well in a class B. Large class As are as easy to drive as a small class B. I personally think they are the easiest of all to drive.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Go look at some B's, or even small C's (sometimes called a B+). Not much room for a dog if it's any bigger than a toy breed. Not much creature comforts either, once you get over the "cute". It's a very expensive van with a bed in the back.

That said, some friends bought a Roadtrek and toured the Western US parks in it over a 3 month period, bringing their MinPin with them. I guess they managed ok, but they sold the Roadtrek at the end of the trip.

 

[Joenew61]

A dog would not do well in a class B. Large class As are as easy to drive as a small class B. I personally think they are the easiest of all to drive.

I can imagine they would go a little stir crazy whether in transit or "docked" somewhere. It's surprising that you see a large class A as easy to drive as a small class B? Just out of curiosity, how did you get started driving the large class A? Was it a sink or swim situation....did you have any training or orientation? I think it is just the initial few drives that are the issue, whether it is lane changes, or 90 degree corners. There has to be at least a little technique or understanding of angles involved?

 

[Isaac-1]

Let me jump in here, tell you a little about my rv background, etc. Like many others I started out tent camping, moved up to a 19 ft 1/2 ton Ford E150 camper van (van with sofa bed, portable toilet in a curtained off area, small water tank and kitchen area with small sink, icebox (not refrigerator, it held a 20 pound block of ice to keep things cold), no generator, no AC air conditioner, etc. The thing was unstable at speeds of over about 60 mph, under powered, etc., but was still a big improvement over a tent. Next was another similar camper van, but this time on a GMC 3/4 ton van chassis, it drove much better, but still lacked amenities like a generator and a real bathroom. I then went a number of years without an RV, life got in the way, got divorced, a few years later got remarried, my second wife had never camped never traveled in an RV, so after 6-7 years of me occasionally bringing up the subject she agreed to give it a try, which lead to us buying our current coach in 2016. It is a 28 ft gas class A, so a small class A, which we have put about 30,000 miles on since buying it mostly traveling central and western US (Louisiana to the Grand Canyon, north as far as Yellowstone, and in a couple of weeks we will be heading to Tennessee), all without a TOAD (though that is about to change with this next trip).

Having said that I feel 28-30 ft is pushing it for the upper end of where it is practical to travel without a TOAD, and on 2 occasions we have rented a car at our destination, others we have used taxis or Uber, some destinations and RV parks we have picked due to availability of public transportation, tourist shuttles, etc. and yes a few times we have missed doing things because it was too much hassle to do in the coach. Having said that there are a lot of places one can squeeze into in a 28 ft coach (29'5" bumper to bumper) without a TOAD, such as my avatar photo, which is the visitor center parking lot at the Blue Bell Ice Cream Creamery in Brenham, Texas. If it were up to me I would probably pick getting a smaller class A coach in the 26 ft range, though my wife says she would not want anything smaller than we have now, and I would not want to loose the cargo capacity, so maybe in reality 28 is the right length for us. I have looked at a lot of motorhomes under the 26-27 range, and I have yet to one I would really like to travel in as much as our 28 ft ft coach, as you have to compromise so much in so many ways once you go much below 26-27 ft. Most will have a wet bath, all will be cramped inside, and all will have very limited size propane, as well as fresh and waste water tanks.

Not too long ago I was watching a youtube video featuring a solo man traveling cross country in a 25 ft Sprinter chassis Class B (or B+), and what really shocked me was how often he had to stop to fill his fresh water tank or dump his waste tanks. I did a little looking online and found that his coach only had a 9 gallon propane tank, a 20 gallon fresh water tank, a 13 gallon gray water tank and a 11 gallon black tank. No wonder he was always looking for a place to dump and fill his tanks, often paying $10+ every day or maybe every other day to dump at truck stops. By contrast our 28 ft class A which is only about 4 feet longer, 6 inches wider and 6 inches taller (and 6,000 pound heavier) than the Sprinter class B in that video has a 32 gallon propane tank, 80 gallons fresh water, along with 40 gallon gray and 40 gallon black tank. Enough that when I am on a solo trip I can go a week without dumping or refilling water without any extreme water conservation issues, and taking a short shower each night.

I will close this with a few photos of our coach parked in places we have seen along the way on our travels, some mid day stops, some campgrounds or boondock camping, even one in someones drive way at their house.

 

[SeilerBird]

I can imagine they would go a little stir crazy whether in transit or "docked" somewhere. It's surprising that you see a large class A as easy to drive as a small class B? Just out of curiosity, how did you get started driving the large class A? Was it a sink or swim situation....did you have any training or orientation? I think it is just the initial few drives that are the issue, whether it is lane changes, or 90 degree corners. There has to be at least a little technique or understanding of angles involved?

I owned several class Bs before I bought a class C. I was driving past the dealership when I spotted the C and I stopped in. They were desperate to sell it so I got a great deal. I never even test drove it, just jumped in and started driving. When my GF bought a class C it was bigger and easier to drive. Then she bought a 39 foot DP and I did test drive a few before she bought it. I liked driving that one the most. It is easy, the back follows the front just like in my rice burner. Then i got rid of the GF and went back to a class B. That lasted two months before I bought a 27 foot class A. To small so I traded that in on a 33 foot class A.

Then 8 years ago my A died so I parked it in my RV park and stopped driving it. Bought a rice burner. I hate driving the rice burner, much prefer the DP. I absolutely hate backing the rice machine up. Tiny mirrors makes it scary to back up. I much prefer backing up a DP with those huge mirrors.

90 degree corners are the easiest. You watch the mirror on the side that has the corner and when your back wheel is parallel to the corner then you start turning the wheel. Impossible to screw it up.

When my GF bought the class C she refused to drive it. Scared to death of it. So on the maiden drive i pulled over and told her it was her time to drive and we were not going anywhere until she drove. With in five minutes she was in love with driving it. I was not about to be driving with someone who would not drive the RV. What would happen if there was a problem and I could not drive and she had to drive.

 

[Mark_K5LXP]

A lot of echoes to all the above. I never drove a class A until the day I owned one, but didn't find it any harder to drive than the big uhaul/penske box trucks I've rented over the years. It's more about awareness of surroundings and building a little muscle memory for anticipating turns, backing skills and such. Nothing a few thousand miles won't do for you.

Initially I was a bit distracted by the choice between a class A or C, or going with a truck/trailer. Each has their niche and everyone has their unique circumstances that gives one the edge. In hindsight a class A works out better for me than a truck/trailer. I look at the class B's with curiosity (the Pleasure Way ones look pretty nice) but per Isaac-1's post there's not enough resources in one to to much more than short trips between RV parks. But, maybe that's the goal - someone's buying these class B's or they wouldn't be making them. Not everyone is about heading for some remote alpine meadow for weeks at a time off grid or hauling 2 tons of their junk around all over the country. Point being is once the end goal is clearly defined, the choice of rig will be a bit more obvious.

The lesson I learned after acquiring my RV is that they require a terrific amount of attention relative to homes and vehicles I've owned, which doesn't change based on the size or class. A key factor towards lessening that pain a bit is having a place you can park it and work on it at your leisure. My home had an RV pad when I bought it and I didn't have an RV until 15 years later. Without it, I'm not sure I'd want an RV. Being able to walk 30 feet from my back door to do maintenance, repairs, updates, pack and unpack it and the bonus, have guests stay in it makes the price of admission for these things a bit more palatable.

Mark B.
Albuquerque, NM

 

[Isaac-1]

Mark has a good point here, I often wish I had room to keep my coach at my house so if the mood struck me I could easily go out and work on it between doing other things around the house. Instead mine lives in a shed on the family cattle ranch 15 miles away, which is nice in many ways as I have access to the workshop area (the other half of the divided metal shed) with air tools large wrenches, torches, arc welders, etc. So still way better than the typical storage lot, but not nearly as nice as if I had those things in my back yard.

Owning an older coach it seems there are always 3-4 pending maintenance / repair/ upgrade projects on the to do list, waiting for an opportunity to get done. So far this spring on mine that list has included getting new tires, new TPMS system, replacing an O-2 sensor, adding a 4 more 12V sockets near the drivers seat, flushing the brake fluid, replacing the 3 wire to 2 wire converter for the trailer wiring harness. A few things still on the to do list some of which I have the parts for, just have not found the time are, installing new brake lines from the ABS unit (old ones are starting to weep at the rubber junctions), install new oil cooler line (old one has rubbed on a bracket, I taped it up, but that is a temporary fix), also repair the furnace (it is short cycling for unknown reason), replace the entry step worn carpet, perhaps with wood, reseal and repaint the roof, plus probably some other stuff I am not thinking of at the moment. By the time I get all that done I suspect something else will be added to the list.

 

[Joenew61]

Thanks all for the perspective and details about your journeys through your RV ownership histories. Lots of great information in there that will help inform our decision on where to focus our search!

Just to recap my recent contemplation of getting a class B, the idea was to split time around 50-50 between staying on the motorhome, and staying in a hotel or other venue on extended cross country trips. But it sounds like the 50% of the time we would have spent staying on the RV with minimal creature comforts, and the challenges of such small payload capacity for such a long trip, would far outweigh the “start up” costs of getting comfortable driving a 38’ class C. I might as well take the pain up front. That being said, I would say it is very unlikely that my wife will be willing to alternate with me behind the wheel. After 30 years, I just know how she is wired.

The other wife factor that originally steered me towards the C vs the A is that we saw a few videos that talked about how each would react to a front impact accident, and that really resonated with her. I realize the chances of that happening are fairly low, but I don’t think the math will influence her thoughts on the matter. That being said, we will look at both and see whether the additional space is something worth trading off for.

So far no class B owners have chimed in on whether a 50-50 split between alternating between using it for pure transportation and using it as a motorhome on the same cross-country trips is a common practice, so it sounds like it probably doesn’t work that way in the real world.

Thanks again!

 

[SeilerBird]

There are not a lot of B owners here because there are very few Bs in existence compared to As and Cs. If you go to the first page of the forums here you can see that there are 13,000 threads in the A and C forum and 500 on the B forum. There are 121 buss conversion threads and 13,000 threads in the travel trailers and fifth wheel forum. The main reason is the Bs are really expensive for what you get compared to an A or a C. Do you want to know what it is like to RV in a B just go lock yourself into a bathroom at your house for a few hours. That is what it is like to own a B and get caught in a rainstorm. I would not even consider the impact results in considering what to buy. Very very few RVs get into a head on collision.

 

[CharlesinGA]

You might watch some of these videos as this couple has a B and live in a sticks and bricks house and travel the western US on some lengthy trips and some short trips. RV'ing in general is an adjustment to your lifestyle and you may or may not like it.

This link is for their channel homepage.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPLWtAskG50xH1fl8V-TJrg

There are not a lot of B owners here because there are very few Bs in existence compared to As and Cs. If you go to the first page of the forums here you can see that there are 13,000 threads in the A and C forum and 500 on the B forum. There are 121 buss conversion threads and 13,000 threads in the travel trailers and fifth wheel forum. The main reason is the Bs are really expensive for what you get compared to an A or a C. Do you want to know what it is like to RV in a B just go lock yourself into a bathroom at your house for a few hours. That is what it is like to own a B and get caught in a rainstorm. I would not even consider the impact results in considering what to buy. Very very few RVs get into a head on collision.

Actually there are a fair number of class B's around (certainly not as many as others) but they are too busy traveling and sight seeing to be bothered with cruising forums ( and yes, I spend WAY too much time on forums, but I have learned alot also)

As far as safety, that is a paramount concern to me. Be it a head on, rollover or side collision, you are safer in a C or B than an A because they (at least the cab area) are designed with safety in mind. I think the quality of construction and fit and finish of the B's I have seen far exceeds the average RV, hence the high price.



Charles

 

[Joenew61]

You might watch some of these videos as this couple has a B and live in a sticks and bricks house and travel the western US on some lengthy trips and some short trips. RV'ing in general is an adjustment to your lifestyle and you may or may not like it.

This link is for their channel homepage.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPLWtAskG50xH1fl8V-TJrg

Actually there are a fair number of class B's around (certainly not as many as others) but they are too busy traveling and sight seeing to be bothered with cruising forums ( and yes, I spend WAY too much time on forums, but I have learned alot also)

As far as safety, that is a paramount concern to me. Be it a head on, rollover or side collision, you are safer in a C or B than an A because they (at least the cab area) are designed with safety in mind. I think the quality of construction and fit and finish of the B's I have seen far exceeds the average RV, hence the high price.



Charles

Yes, I did notice the per SQ foot price of Bs is much higher than As and Cs. It might be possible just because there are so many more buyers that can at least reach the all in price point of the Bs, but the real answer is "because they can".

Thanks for the link.

 

[Isaac-1]

Just a couple of more points on the whole Class B / Class C, class A comparison when it comes to living space, crash safety, etc.

First off, it all comes down to what you are comparing it to, compared to a tent any RV is going to seem spacious and luxurious, compared to a house they will all seem small and cramped, the middle ground is comparing them to a motel room, which is what I think you are doing, in which case it is a trade off between having all your stuff there, vs living out of a suitcase, the question then becomes are you comparing it to a cramped budget motel room, or an extended stay suite with separate living room, and kitchenette. In other words it is all relative once again.

As to real world safety, it is true that class B's and C's have better engineered cabs, that in theory may do better in an accident, however a class A is built on a heavier commercial delivery truck chassis, with a much higher seating position, etc. So what it comes down to is what you impact with, if it is anything smaller than a commercial truck chances are the roof of the other vehicle is going to be at or below your foot level, and you will mostly ride up over it (likely totaling the coach in the process). If you follow the online forums for a while you will find that the vast majority of class A accident fatalities occur when the coach hits an immovable object at highway speed, ie runs off the road and hits a concrete piling, etc.

So sure in theory class A's are not as safe in an accident, but before you decide class A's are not able to take an impact and let the occupants survive I suggest you watch this video of a 30ish year old 30ish foot class A.

or if you prefer just the highlights

 

[Joenew61]

Just a couple of more points on the whole Class B / Class C, class A comparison when it comes to living space, crash safety, etc.

First off, it all comes down to what you are comparing it to, compared to a tent any RV is going to seem spacious and luxurious, compared to a house they will all seem small and cramped, the middle ground is comparing them to a motel room, which is what I think you are doing, in which case it is a trade off between having all your stuff there, vs living out of a suitcase, the question then becomes are you comparing it to a cramped budget motel room, or an extended stay suite with separate living room, and kitchenette. In other words it is all relative once again.

As to real world safety, it is true that class B's and C's have better engineered cabs, that in theory may do better in an accident, however a class A is built on a heavier commercial delivery truck chassis, with a much higher seating position, etc. So what it comes down to is what you impact with, if it is anything smaller than a commercial truck chances are the roof of the other vehicle is going to be at or below your foot level, and you will mostly ride up over it (likely totaling the coach in the process). If you follow the online forums for a while you will find that the vast majority of class A accident fatalities occur when the coach hits an immovable object at highway speed, ie runs off the road and hits a concrete piling, etc.

So sure in theory class A's are not as safe in an accident, but before you decide class A's are not able to take an impact and let the occupants survive I suggest you watch this video of a 30ish year old 30ish foot class A.

or if you prefer just the highlights

Great point regarding the size comparisons between RV and hotel and home. I guess a decent size C or A will be roughly equivalent to an above average hotel room, and in most cases have more amenities. The way I was thinking about it was not so much to have the hotel room serve as an upgrade over the RV, but rather to be a way to be able to buy a smaller (B) RV that would give us more destination options, easier driving/parking, and still have half the nights not cramped in a small RV. Also, moving into and out of a hotel room is probably a little less work overall than setting up and then breaking camp with a C and a Toad.

That was an intense video for sure. I guess I will now take "rig-jacking" off our options for acquiring our first RV.

 

[Isaac-1]

All of my experience to date involves traveling without a TOAD, though we do now have my wife's car set up for TOAD duty and have test attached and detached it from the motorhome a handful of times. With that in mind I find the setup time from pulling into the parking lot, to feet propped up and watching TV for a typical RV park and a typical mid range hotel to be roughly comparable, the same may or may not go for departure, depending on how much stuff in the RV has to be stowed for travel mode, though the hotel comparsion extends here to with how much stuff was unpacked and hauled into the hotel room. Either way we are not talking a lot of time difference, for an overnight stop with pull through RV site so no unhooking a TOAD (required for backing), I would estimate my total setup time from pulling into the RV site to being settled is typically under 5 minutes, though I do have a class A with leveling jacks.

If we were to assume the typical roadside commercial RV park with typically gravel sites and minimal frills (they may have a bath house which I never use, and a laundry room and that is about it). Some may have self pay kiosk others either an office, or occasionally a camp host (some long term RV resident that collects money, etc.) Call it the RV equivalence of a Motel 6, pull in, check in will take roughly the same amount of time as motel check in, pull around to a pull through site and park, similar again to a motel / hotel parking time, particularly if you will be going in a different entrance door than the lobby, say an extra 45 seconds or so to pull in and get aligned, put the coach in park, press the extend button on the leveling jacks, call it 30 seconds to get the leveling jacks sorted (if on pavement I would get out first and put protective pads down under the jacks, but on gravel I don't bother). Turn the engine off, go outside, open the electrical bay door, fish the shore cord out, plug shore power cord into the power post, and turn on the breaker (2 minutes), go back inside wait for the EMS system to test and connect to the power (about 120 seconds before the lights come on, air conditioner starts up, etc). And that is it for a typical overnight stop, usually I don't bother hooking up water or sewer upon arrival, as mentioned above I have 80 gallon fresh water tank, and usually travel with it at least 2/3 full, which is at least 3-4 days supply with my wife and I both n the coach. If I do need to dump and refill I will do it the next morning before departure, which will add maybe 8-10 minutes to the otherwise similar 5 minute departure check list.

p.s. after a few years and a couple of hundred nights aboard our 28 ft class A coach I sort of feel odd staying in a hotel room, something I last did a bit over a year ago in downtown Houston. It is odd not having my own pillow, having to get clothes out of a suitcase, or not having my preferred midnight snacks handy, there is sort of novelty to it now. Unless it was a luxury hotel I would generally prefer to spend the night in our coach, even if the motel room might have a bit more open floor space, though I must admit after 3-4 weeks traveling in the motorhome and only taking showers, I do sometimes get tempted to get a model room just to soak in a bath tub for a change.

 

[Tom55555]

When my GF bought the class C she refused to drive it. Scared to death of it. So on the maiden drive i pulled over and told her it was her time to drive and we were not going anywhere until she drove. With in five minutes she was in love with driving it. I was not about to be driving with someone who would not drive the RV. What would happen if there was a problem and I could not drive and she had to drive.

Our RV is only 24' with dullies. A Ford E350 is basically a pick up truck so it will go places if you put it in fist gear, go slow and watch your line.

 

[Isaac-1]

To put that length into comparison my 21 year old crew cab F250 short bed is 22 ft, the long bed version is about a foot longer, and I have driven it on surface streets in downtown Houston multiple times, though parking can be a pain in smaller parking lots.

 

[Viajeros]

We travelled for months at a time in Mexico in a 21 foot B plus. Easy to turn around, park etc. Always a spot available for a little coach like that. Tight though with the pooch.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

It seems to me you are considering only the extremes - a 22 ft Class B vs a 38-40 ft Super-C or Class A. A class B is inherently small because it fits inside a standard van body, but you break that limit if you move up just a bit to a smallish Class C (sometimes called a B+). Starting at about 25 ft, that size offers much more usable & comfortable layouts (especially if it has a slide) without the drawbacks of a looonng vehicle.

Take a look at something like a Winnebago View or Renegade Vienna and I think you will find something that is both a comfortable traveler and an easy driver. Both are on the Mercedes Sprinter diesel van chassis.