If you boondock a lot . . .

[Pgh_AL]

Since im new to the RV world I need to ask a question on this topic . Is it safe and practical to carry a twenty pound tank as a spare .

I have a few of the and thought id put one in the rig as a spare . Just a thought . Thanks in advance

 

[DonTom]

Honestly I've never tried.

I have, it wasn't possible as my tank is attached to my RV, not removable. Removable tanks were no problem in NM. It was the day before XMAS when I was in the Carlsbad area. But after 1700 hrs. There were several propane ONLY places, but they were all closed. My refrigerator was still working but the gauge was at zero. I could only find such closed places in southern NM, but if I needed a portable tank trade-in, there were gas stations in NM that had them.

On XMAS day, I was in AZ and was able to get my propane tank filled at the first gas station I checked across the border. So I assumed from all that, the rules were different in NM. No gas stations in NM could fill my tank. This was in Dec three years ago.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[DonTom]

"they" do, my Outdoors RV 24rks is a prime example..

I should have said "motorhome" instead of "RV". Is there a decent small motorhome that is especially good for boondocking?

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[DonTom]

normally an EE would not use amps either,

I also prefer watts, but it seems to me that most ratings are in amps.

In fact, I often find it annoying to use amps.

For an example, right now, I am charging my 75KWH Tesla battery with a 48 amp, 240 VAC Tesla Wall connector. Even the same company won't be consistent in which they use. How long it takes to charge would be easier to figure out in my head if I were charging at ~12KW instead of ~48 amps.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[DonTom]

The 12VDC units will run off the converter when on shore power?

Of course. There is no issue with 12V refrigerators, IMO, when there is shore power.

In fact, while driving or when having shore power, I would probably prefer a new 12V only refrigerator. I think the only issue is the current draw when boondocked. Even that will not be a big issue if the generator is ran enough.

But the last time I was boondocked for a couple of weeks (last December in OPCNM, AZ), my generator crapped out. I got by with using the RV engine and my 4KW inverter. Glad my propane refrigerator wasn't wasting power then, as a 12V only would.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[Pgh_AL]

I should have said "motorhome" instead of "RV". Is there a decent small motorhome that is especially good for boondocking?

-Don- Reno, NV

I

Of course. There is no issue with 12V refrigerators, IMO, when there is shore power.

In fact, while driving or when having shore power, I would probably prefer a new 12V only refrigerator. I think the only issue is the current draw when boondocked. Even that will not be a big issue if the generator is ran enough.

But the last time I was boondocked for a couple of weeks (last December in OPCNM, AZ), my generator crapped out. I got by with using the RV engine and my 4KW inverter. Glad my propane refrigerator wasn't wasting power then, as a 12V only would.

-Don- Ren

Can't do a poll here?

Anyway, my question is . . .

If you boondock a lot . . . Would you consider a NEW RV with a 12 Volt ONLY refrigerator?

-Don- Reno, NV

Now that I've had a chance to deduce this topic my answer is no . Im going to take my chances with the LP/110 refrigerator.

I seem to think it would fit my style of Boondocking I like to have cold food and beverages . And im tired of buying ice everyday .

I enjoy cooking my own food and watching TV .The LP to me is the best thing since sliced bread. My tv is 12v by design and the refrigerator voltage draw is minimal.

At best I might maybe have to run my gen about ah I'd say about half hour every 24 hours to keep up with my electrical demands . Thus far.

 

[Pgh_AL]

I should have said "motorhome" instead of "RV". Is there a decent small motorhome that is especially good for boondocking?

-Don- Reno, NV

I

Of course. There is no issue with 12V refrigerators, IMO, when there is shore power.

In fact, while driving or when having shore power, I would probably prefer a new 12V only refrigerator. I think the only issue is the current draw when boondocked. Even that will not be a big issue if the generator is ran enough.

But the last time I was boondocked for a couple of weeks (last December in OPCNM, AZ), my generator crapped out. I got by with using the RV engine and my 4KW inverter. Glad my propane refrigerator wasn't wasting power then, as a 12V only would.

-Don- Ren

 

[DonTom]

In a way, I would like to give the new 12V refrigerators a chance, but I am not sure if that is such a great idea, especially when using rather small L-A batteries.

I know I can get by with one by simply running the generator or RV engine more often, but I prefer more than just "getting by" when boondocked with other loads as well.

And as those L-A batteries age in the 2022 Thor Axis I have been looking at, I expect issues. No easy way to put in lith batteries in that small battery box or anywhere else.

IMO, my old junky Y2K RV is very practical for my use. 300 AHs of lith battery and propane refrigerator that works well. And an 80 amp lith converter. 4KW genny. 4 KW inverter.

Perhaps this isn't the time for me to buy a new small Class A RV. But I will still be looking.

I wonder if all new RV fridges with soon be DC only . . or if RV sales drop enough, go back to propane. 8 amps DC and the choice of Propane would probably be the best way these days. No need for the 120 AC operation these days. But the 120 VAC will be the cheapest to make and then just drop the DC operation and keep the propane. IOW, go back 20 years.

I really think if that 2022 Thor Axis had a propane choice for the refrigerator, I would own it.

I still could anyway, I am undecided if an extra 8 amps (or a bit less depending on duty cycle) should be a deal breaker for me or not. If I could put my 300AH Lith battery and 80 amp lith converter in there, then it would not be such of a big deal.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[UTTransplant]

I know lots of people it’s motorhomes that boondock for weeks at a time, heading in for water and a dump station every week or two. The brands range from older American RV to brand new Newmars. The best thing is to look for big tanks. Ours has 90 fresh, 70 gray, and 50 black. You can add solar, batteries, etc, but water and waste are harder. We also have a residential refrigerator, another thing you just plan your power usage around.

 

[Pgh_AL]

In a way, I would like to give the new 12V refrigerators a chance, but I am not sure if that is such a great idea, especially when using rather small L-A batteries.

I know I can get by with one by simply running the generator or RV engine more often, but I prefer more than just "getting by" when boondocked with other loads as well.

And as those L-A batteries age in the 2022 Thor Axis I have been looking at, I expect issues. No easy way to put in lith batteries in that small battery box or anywhere else.

IMO, my old junky Y2K RV is very practical for my use. 300 AHs of lith battery and propane refrigerator that works well. And an 80 amp lith converter. 4KW genny. 4 KW inverter.

Perhaps this isn't the time for me to buy a new small Class A RV. But I will still be looking.

I wonder if all new RV fridges with soon be DC only . . or if RV sales drop enough, go back to propane. 8 amps DC and the choice of Propane would probably be the best way these days. No need for the 120 AC operation these days. But the 120 VAC will be the cheapest to make and then just drop the DC operation and keep the propane. IOW, go back 20 years.

I really think if that 2022 Thor Axis had a propane choice for the refrigerator, I would own it.

I still could anyway, I am undecided if an extra 8 amps (or a bit less depending on duty cycle) should be a deal breaker for me or not. If I could put my 300AH Lith battery and 80 amp lith converter in there, then it would not be such of a big deal.

-Don- Reno, NV

Someday battery and solar power will be superior to any other source of energy imo but for now today it's LP/110 . I realize batteries have come a long way but they still have a ways to go.

 

[chuckbear]

We had a 12volt Vitrifrigo fridge on our boat for about ten years. We lived aboard and spent a lot of time at anchor. While we had a battery monitor, after some point we stopped worrying about how much the fridge was using because it wasn’t very much. It kept our ice cream frozen and that was very important to us. Batteries were four 6volt golf carts. Solar power during they day and a wind generator provided charging. Chuck

 

[Mark_K5LXP]

Not often mentioned in RV forums are the refrigerators sold for the solar market, like the Sun Frost brand. They tout 1/5 the energy use of a residential fridge. I know someone that has one in their solar home and they basically amount to a boxy looking fridge with lots of insulation, passively cooled coils and no automatic defrost. Seems if someone wanted to go down the road of solar electric boondocking one could entertain the idea of one of these rather than a less efficient, cheapest for the builder supplied one.

Mark B
Albuquerque, NM

 

[Memtb]

Can't do a poll here?

Anyway, my question is . . .

If you boondock a lot . . . Would you consider a NEW RV with a 12 Volt ONLY refrigerator?

-Don- Reno, NV

No! memtb

 

[Old_Crow]

Since im new to the RV world I need to ask a question on this topic . Is it safe and practical to carry a twenty pound tank as a spare .

I have a few of the and thought id put one in the rig as a spare . Just a thought . Thanks in advance

I full time in my motorhome and whenever I park for more than a day or two I have an external tank hooked up to my extend-a-stay hose. I carry 3 30lb cylinders with me on a hitch mounted carrier behind my toad(Jeep Wrangler). I also carry a 6 gal gas can back there. I've added lights and reflective tape to the carrier, and I figure anyone who rear ends me will probably die a fiery death.
As far as my on-board propane supply, I think that tank is about 18 gallons and I usually only fill it once or twice a year.

 

[JayArr]

First off, no, I like my propane fridge.

A couple of points I thought of while reading the other responses... I think there are two types of 12V fridges and it might be good to specify which we are talking about. There is an older technology called Peltier coolers that has semiconductors with two heat sinks and when current is applied one gets hot and the other gets cold. I believe this is what a lot of the older plug in coolers used. I don't know if it's efficient enough to keep a whole fridge cold.

A newer technology has come out that has a 12V compressor. These compressors are also used in electric cars for AC. These fridges use standard refrigeration chemicals and operate like house fridges. One thing to note is that inside the one I looked at was a whole set of electronics to convert the 12VDC into AC to run the motor. It's not some miraculous new compressor motor it just has the inverter built in. This isn't likely to be any more "efficient" than running a house fridge off an inverter as far as power consumption goes. It doesn't matter if you make the AC power in your inverter or inside the compressor.

The other thing I thought I'd mention is the difference between the OEM absorption units and the replacement units from places like the Amish. Our ice cream was never frozen hard with our OEM unit but when it finally failed (30+ years) I replaced it with a unit from RVCoolingunit.com and now we take the ice cream out before we start eating so it will soften up before we get to dessert time. The replacement units are much improved so if you are thinking of replacing your fridge because of poor performance it would be a mistake to think that you need to convert to a 12V fridge to get better cooling.

I HTH

JayArr

 

[DonTom]

The DC only refrigerator in the 2022 Thor Axis draws 8 amps. It also has a "night mode" (whatever that means) and then draws 5 amps.

The old 3-way refrigerators used back in the 1980's, what did they draw in the 12 volt mode? I know it was so much it was useless if not driving. It was simply a way to not have to keep the propane tank on while driving. But I am curious how it compares.

Perhaps that is also the main idea behind the new 12V refrigerators too, can then keep the propane tank valve off while driving.

-Don-

 

[DonTom]

It seems to me that most here are saying a modern 12 volt only refrigerator in a new RV would be a deal killer.

It is the main thing stopping me from buying a new 2022 Thor Axis.

-Don- Reno, NV

 

[Memtb]

The DC only refrigerator in the 2022 Thor Axis draws 8 amps. It also has a "night mode" (whatever that means) and then draws 5 amps.

The old 3-way refrigerators used back in the 1980's, what did they draw in the 12 volt mode? I know it was so much it was useless if not driving. It was simply a way to not have to keep the propane tank on while driving. But I am curious how it compares.

Perhaps that is also the main idea behind the new 12V refrigerators too, can then keep the propane tank valve off while driving.

-Don-

If you’re boondocking.....8 amps is a pretty big amp draw! Assuming you are using solar for your battery charging, and you boondock in warm temperatures and long daylight periods..... you may be OK!

That would never work for much of our boondocking! The long cool nights (single digits F) and short daylight periods for solar charging, would require a lot of generator usage! memtb

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

The absorption fridges with a 12v mode used 12v to power a heater and draws were typically 20A-25A (240+ watts). Worse yet, those fridges have a typical warm-weather, daytime duty cycle in the 75%-100% range, so the suck all day long. So absorption fridges are only practical on propane or shore power. On the other hand, 12v compressor fridges have duty cycles more like 25% and much lower amp draws. The amp-hour load of a 12v compressor rig isn't so terrible to contemplate.

Boondocking for a couple days with a 12v compressor fridge doesn't seem like a big deal to me - you carry an additional (or larger) battery or two. But at some point (3+ days?) more battery amp-hours gets impractical and it makes more sense to recharge by either solar or genset.

If an absorption and a compressor fridge performed the same, the absorption choice would be a no-brainer. But they don't. Compressor fridge cool faster and more evenly, can handle much higher ambient temperatures, are less vulnerable to corrosion and fire (overheating).

 

[Matt_C]

I am acutely aware that I will be the sample at one end of the curve, but here goes.
Our coach is smaller than most, but when it was assembled in 1973, they were only available with an electric refrigerator. It was a Norcold that was happy with both 12VDC and 120VAC. We did a lot of both real boondocking and drycamping for years. The OE house bank (a single Grp 31) was undersize most of the time, but that got changed. First to a 4D (~160ah and 130#), then to a pair of GC2s that were easier to manage. That failed a few years back and I replaced it with a dorm reefer and cheap (really cheap) modified square wave inverter. The demand from the house bank was not much different. Pre-Covid there was a music festival (July in Michigan) we rarely missed. FHU sites were sold out for weeks in advance. We found a shady place outside of the park. To keep the house bank up, I just had to be sure to run out generator for a few hours both morning and evening to keep the house bank up. We have used this same plan lots of other places. If we can ever travel again, we will use the same plan.