Is it possible for entertainers to trade a night of entertainment in exchange for an RV space- 1 week?

[Tom]

So Tom.. I used to play keyboard back in the day. And back then, nobody (at least not that I knew) worried about this. We played local bars and such and just got the door (or maybe a percent of the door).
I’m curious how careful musicians need to be these days. (Besides those that don’t care or worry about it), I assume it does not really apply to non-paid performance (or maybe it does and my next question is how can I get a copyright on ‘Happy Birthday’ ). But what about musicians who play for whatever the listening public adds to their top jar or open guitar case? And if they’re paid only by tips, is the establishment required to be compliant even if they’re not paying?
The internet sure changed the music industry, didn’t it?

ASCAP & BMI rules seem to change over time. Here's ASCAP's current site:

https://www.ascap.com/help/ascap-li...kVe_I9ZHO6ZKr6M07Y1PS1DunN_JTGcMaAuyrEALw_wcB

Don't know about the influence of the Internet, but the founders of ASCAP were Irving Berlin, James Weldon Johnson, Jerome Kern, John Philip Sousa. It was founded in 1914.

 

[Larry N.]

how can I get a copyright on ‘Happy Birthday’ )

I don't think you can, though there was a time...

From NBC News in 2015:

A settlement has been reached in a U.S. lawsuit with Warner/Chappell Music over the copyright to "Happy Birthday to You" that will put one of the world's most recognizable songs in the public domain, according to court papers released on Wednesday and a source close to the case.

 

[NY_Dutch]

A good friend of ours that does a one woman show paid about $20,000 in legal fees and judgments when ASCAP and BMI both went after her for copyright license violations over the course of 5 years in small venues. Now she only performs her own works or works that she holds the copyrights for. A small bar near our upstate NY cottage filed for bankruptcy after losing a BMI lawsuit.

 

[NY_Dutch]

Interesting.

Does anyone KNOW someone that they came after? Maybe yourself?

What do they do to you?

It's a civil lawsuit issue, so no one is likely to go to jail over it. Their checkbook could take a big hit though.

 

[Tom]

A good friend of ours that does a one woman show paid about $20,000 in legal fees and judgments when ASCAP and BMI both went after her for copyright license violations over the course of 5 years in small venues. Now she only performs her own works or works that she holds the copyrights for. A small bar near our upstate NY cottage filed for bankruptcy after losing a BMI lawsuit.

Ouch! That's a good data point Dutch, and should answer the question someone asked earlier in this thread.

 

[jymbee]

Do you perform only your own works? Or do you also do covers. For covers, as I'm sure you know, the parks would need blanket ASCAP, BMI, and possibly GMR, copyright licenses to avoid any legal entanglements. That may prove to be a deal killer for many of them...

That's interesting and something I was unaware of. Is getting these licenses just a formality or... ? Cost?

There's no doubt that a lot of venues and performers are either ignorant of the issue, or choose to ignore it. I recently talked to a part-time performer who had just performed at a venue where we were thinking of performing, and asked if they or he had any of the licenses. His reaction was "I don't worry about that stuff; They're not going to come after me".

Very similar attitude I see when it comes of FAA licenses for drone operators. I'm fully licensed but I would venture to guess that many if not the majority of those flying for $$ have the same attitude.

 

[NY_Dutch]

That's interesting and something I was unaware of. Is getting these licenses just a formality or... ? Cost?

I'm not up on current public performance fees, but I do know that a jukebox license through the Jukebox Licensing Office (JLO), a joint ASCAP, BMI, SESAC venture, is currently $554 annually for the first jukebox. That's cheaper than the individual licenses would cost. There's no combined license for live entertainment though.

 

[Henry J Fate]

I am a lifelong entertainer (guitarist / vocalist) who has made a living as a "one man band" for over 20 years.
I am thinking of doing the full time RV living lifestyle, but I'm wondering if some larger RV Parks would exchange a weeks rent for
a night of music for their guests. For regular bars and nightclubs, I charge from $200 - $500 a night. They could even add a small
cover charge the night I play, and actually make a profit from giving me a space for a week. Anybody have any experience with this?
I'm thinking of shooting for early 2023. Also also prefer WARM climates! LOL I'm in Florida now! For references, my website is dinodanger.com

Site specific. You would first need to find a park that has live music and one that would be a good fit for your style of music. From there you could maybe work something out but it is unlikely you would be able to organize something like this without showing up first as any place that is offering live music on a regular basis, probably has performers in place. The other issue is price. Some of the highly sought after months in South Florida for example, will get $400 a week for a space. I am not sure what you would expect to be paid but there are live performers that except much less for a night of music.

Much like what you are probably currently doing, it will come down to getting out there and doing your thing. I assume you must be doing special events like weddings and parties? Those events tend to be things that develop over time as you gain exposure in your area of performing. Unless you have contacts where you plan to go, you will more or less be starting over and will most likely need more that just an RV park to make a suitable income.

My guess is that what ever you are doing now to make a sustainable income, you will need to do pretty much the same thing where ever you decide to go. If you plan on retiring or scaling back your activity, you will probably be in a better position. Most importantly, be sure you are ready to give up what you have now as I would tend to think that you spent quite a long time building what you have.

 

[DutchmenSport]

Many years ago, in my former life, I was a pastor in ... well ... several churches over the years. On occasion we were challenged by someone in the congregation, usually someone new to the church, that would bring up copyright and licensing material.

We always sang from a traditional hymnal, and when there were specials, it was always based on sheet music. In some of the smaller churches I was at, someone would willie-nillie copy and sing a popular song or tune.

The answer we got from our "better" sources was, as long as we were not broadcasting, recording, and reproducing the music for re-distribution, we were good to go. And if we had original store bought music scores, song books, and hymnals, that covered the license to use them in our services. Ours was a traditional old-school church and we sang mostly public domain songs anyway. But on occasion, we'd get something more contemporary. If we broadcasted the services, then we'd need all the special licensing. We never did anything like that.

 

[NY_Dutch]

Many years ago, in my former life, I was a pastor in ... well ... several churches over the years. On occasion we were challenged by someone in the congregation, usually someone new to the church, that would bring up copyright and licensing material.

We always sang from a traditional hymnal, and when there were specials, it was always based on sheet music. In some of the smaller churches I was at, someone would willie-nillie copy and sing a popular song or tune.

The answer we got from our "better" sources was, as long as we were not broadcasting, recording, and reproducing the music for re-distribution, we were good to go. And if we had original store bought music scores, song books, and hymnals, that covered the license to use them in our services. Ours was a traditional old-school church and we sang mostly public domain songs anyway. But on occasion, we'd get something more contemporary. If we broadcasted the services, then we'd need all the special licensing. We never did anything like that.

I sent off a quick church service usage inquiry to my IP lawyer earlier today, and this is what he sent back with the reference link:

"Churches do not need a performance license to play / perform copyrighted music IN A WORSHIP SERVICE. Note the importance of those last words. Your church might play music in their coffee shop. They might play it as part of their telephone’s “on hold” music. Oh, and don’t forget about Vacation Bible School! In such cases, you need to follow copyright protocol and pay for the licensing. It’s only in the case of the worship service that you are free to use the music either by playing it or performing it. There is one exception but let’s keep this simple for now."

Church Music Copyright Infringement

Myths and dangers of not following proper church music copyright licensing protocol. PLUS, a guide to using the right copyright license.

www.behindthemixer.com