Quick question on roof sealers

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rutherford.ms

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 19, 2006
Posts
64
Location
Montpelier or Surf City - it just depends!
My unit has a fiberglass roof and I am getting ready to add a sat. dish so of course need some sealer. The dealer sold me a silicone based caulking but as I was reading Livingstone's book, it mentioned to not use silicone with a fiberglass roof.

So, what is the correct type of caulk and why is a silicone/fiberglass combination bad?
 
Silicone doesn't adhere well to fiberglass, and also pulls back (shrinks) over time. Dicor makes a very good adhesive for this purpose. If you never plan to remove the dish, 3M 5200 sealant/adhesive (available at Home Depot) is as good as they get.
 
Fleetwood American Coach recommends and uses Alpha Self Leveling All Weather Sealant #1015 on their fiberglass roofs. However, they do not use it around the skylights, where they think it may cause cracking of the skylight material. There they use Surebond  SB-140 Architectural Elastomeric Rubber.

American Coach also recommends Geocel Tripolymer Sealant   for use where a self-leveling sealer is not suitable (e.g. vertical surfaces)             
 
Most RV dealers have either the Alpha or the similar Dicor self leveling lap sealant.  It is sometimes sold as "rubber roof sealant".  I bought some of the Geocel Proflex at Camping World a couple weeks ago and they carry the Dicor too. You can go to a store or mail order. Ace hardware carries the Geocel products and might have one I suggested.
 
Gary, (or anybody, of course):

A few dumb questions (I still miss that old  section! ;D):

1. Do you know what type of roof my RV has (the 2000 Fleetwood Tioga 24D Class C listed below)?  I have stuff in writing from Fleetwood that says it's rubber, but it does NOT look anything like rubber to me (I can take a pix of  the roof the next time I am in Reno, which will be this coming Wednesday or Thursday).  It looks NOTHING like the roof of my older 79 RV which was rubber and looked exactly like rubber.

2. If it's rubber, will that 3m 5200 work with rubber, or should I use something else? I noticed it only mentions wood and fiberglass on the containers.

I am thinking about "gluing" down a few solar panels up there. I do have the brackets, but not a clue about the correct & safe way to mount them using what.

3. And do you know the limit to those solar controllers that are built into the A/C units? I mean it has a 5 watt solar panel up there now, which means it does about nothing or so. Would it still work okay with ten times that (~50 watts or about four amps)  worth of solar panels?

-Don- SSF, CA​

 
Your 2000 Tioga roof is almost surely EPDM rubber. I would use a sealer from Dicor or Alpha which is designed for EPDM rubber. Note that these are sealers, not adhesives. Screw the panel brackets to the roof and then seal. In fact, I would put sealer under the bracket first and then screw through it and finish up with sealer on the top.


Would it still work okay with ten times that (~50 watts or about four amps)  worth of solar panels?

There is no solar controller in  the a/c unit - the little 5w panel is merely mounted on the a/c housing. There is usually no controller at all for these little panels - they put out so little current (about 300 ma in this case) that no regulation is needed. A bigger panel will definitely need a controller added.
 
RV Roamer said:
Your 2000 Tioga roof is almost surely EPDM rubber. I would use a sealer from Dicor or Alpha which is designed for EPDM rubber. Note that these are sealers, not adhesives. Screw the panel brackets to the roof and then seal. In fact, I would put sealer under the bracket first and then screw through it and finish up with sealer on the top.

Thanks. That must be it as it does look much like this.

What type of screws should be used with this EPDM rubber?

There is no solar controller in  the a/c unit - the little 5w panel is merely mounted on the a/c housing. There is usually no controller at all for these little panels - they put out so little current (about 300 ma in this case) that no regulation is needed. A bigger panel will definitely need a controller added.

Oh, that LED built into the bottom of the A/C unit looked like the one on my old solar controller and that made me incorrectly assume there was a small controller in there. But now I understand it's just an led to show the solar has some output voltage.


-Don- SSF, CA​
 
RV EPDM roofing is normally white and just has a slight texture, like fabric. It is glued to a plywood underlayment.

You are really screwing into the plywood underlayment of the roof, which is typically not real thick but with insulation under that.  I would probably use a 1-1/4" #8 or #10 panhead screw.
 
RV Roamer said:
RV EPDM roofing is normally white and just has a slight texture, like fabric. It is glued to a plywood underlayment.

You are really screwing into the plywood underlayment of the roof, which is typically not real thick but with insulation under that.  I would probably use a 1-1/4" #8 or #10 panhead screw.

Oh, wood screws not EPDM rubber screws. ;D  I will probably start this job this coming Thursday by mounting at least the first panel up there. And I will look for a good place to mount the controller.

Thanks for the info!

-Don- SF, CA​
 
Don,

Try to find the rafters that support the roof to ensure the panels are really tied down.  We lost a small panel that was tied to the top of an air conditioner when the rivets/screws tore out in the wind.  I believe the large panels on our MH are tied into them.
 
I've even screwed a boat rack to the plywood (only) and never lost anything, but it is always possible you will run into extreme winds. By all means find a cross member if you can, but I wouldn't lose sleep if I could not find one where I needed it. I've got a large solar panel and a satellite dome up there and I doubt if  their bracket pattern conforms to my roof's structural members except by good luck.
 
Gary,

Living where we do in the land of strong winds, we make sure to tie everything down as best we can.  A friend lost his awning the other day parked in the drive of his house.  My wind gage indicated 80+ MPH. :'(
 
My thanks to all for the tips. I went to another RV dealer close by and found some of the Dicor sealant for my project.

I have another question about something I found up on the roof, but never paid attention to it before. I have what looks like a vent tube sitting up a few inches near the front of the RV, but it has a metallic, kind of foil-like cover on it. I am not going to do anything to it, but just curious about what it could be. It is not a vent, the other vents have a normal venting cap on them.
 
RV Roamer said:
I've even screwed a boat rack to the plywood (only) and never lost anything, but it is always possible you will run into extreme winds. By all means find a cross member if you can, but I wouldn't lose sleep if I could not find one where I needed it. I've got a large solar panel and a satellite dome up there and I doubt if  their bracket pattern conforms to my roof's structural members except by good luck.

Well, I tried doing it without a stud finder (I think I have one somewhere here, but couldn't find it and will buy one for sure tomorrow) and the plywood under my EPDM must be tissue paper thin. I cannot even tell when the screws are tightened down as there's almost no resistance at all when fully down (1.5" wood screws, a little thicker than you suggested so it fits my bracket holes better without a big washer). I did complete one solar panel, but I think I will have to remove it if the Dicor sealant isn't helping to hold it down. Or does that Dicor sealent help hold the brackets when it dries?  If it doesn't, I will have to remove the panel and seal up the 16 holes (four holes for the screws in each panel bracket) in the roof.

BTW, I think this forum could use some library info on solar panel installations.  Another interesting thing I discovered was that the stock 5 watt solar panel has the EXACT same type of connector as my new panels, new panels will plug right in, but then  IN REVERSE POLARITY..

Anyway, Harbor Fright Tools has a three solar panel kit (15 watts each for a total of 45 watts) on sale this week for $179.00. Includes the controller, cables lights and stuff. Not really designed for RV's, but it will work for such. I purchased the set today. They normally ask $250.00 for this set.

Along with one panel I installed today, and the 5 watt stock one, I will have 65 watts total possible of solar when completed.

The solar controller looks cool. But I had to remove the feet and upside down the face plate and install it like this (see photo below). It has USB power outputs and 3, 6, 9 and several 12 VDC outputs built in. This solar controller install works for those under 6 feet and 6 inches or so tall in my RV.  The bottom of the A/C unit was an ideal place to mount the solar controller in my RV because that's where all the wiring meets and that is where I reversed the popularity so I didn't have to reverse all the new solar panel connectors. Now, I only have to reverse the stock 5 watt panel's polarity if I don't remove it and use it for something else, like to help charge the engine's  battery.

Anyway, if I cannot find places that are better to mount my panels, do you have any suggestions?  And the one I have up there now, do you think I should remove it because of the problem with the screws no holding, or what? I was planning on waiting a few days and seeing if I can remove a bracket using just a little force straight up. If the sealant doesn't help hold it more than the screws, I will be forced to remove it until there's a better idea.

BTW, there's a satellite dish up there that looks like it's holding, but whoever installed that must have known what he was doing, unlike me :( . I can only see the sealant on those dish brackets, so I don't know what is really holding them  down but my solar brackets  look like that too now, perhaps even the same sealant used. Looks the same, anyway. But I don't feel that my screws are holding much of anything and that makes me nervous. Any ideas?

-Don- Reno, NV​
 

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Jim Godward said:
Don,

Try to find the rafters that support the roof to ensure the panels are really tied down.  We lost a small panel that was tied to the top of an air conditioner when the rivets/screws tore out in the wind.  I believe the large panels on our MH are tied into them.

I got a stud finder and it detects metal across the roof of the RV at a few places. Are you saying that I should  screw directly into these using sheet metal screws?

I hope to be able to get at least one screw into something solid. Screwing into other places on my roof is like screwing into cardboard at best. Cannot tighten the screws at all, and I tried various sizes and lengths of wood screws. However,  I did leave that one panel up there and after the sealant dried a day it does seem to hold better than I expected as the panel  cannot be removed with a moderate upward force.  So it's holding down at least somewhat but knowing the screws are not doing much might mean there's a chance of the solar panel flying off the roof while on the freeway. I don't know if the way it's holding is good news or bad as I am not sure is I should try to remove the panel or not.

-Don-SSF, CA​
 
DonTom said:
I got a stud finder and it detects metal across the roof of the RV at a few places. Are you saying that I should  screw directly into these using sheet metal screws?

...............SNIP........................
-Don-SSF, CA​

Yes if at all possible.  You want the panels to stay there.
 
Jim Godward said:
Yes if at all possible.  You want the panels to stay there.

Is there a size of sheet metal screw that you would recommend?  Length and thickness?

I assume the way to do this is to drill a small hole in the metal and then use a thicker sheet metal screw.

BTW, do you know approximately how thick each stage is? I mean the EPDM rubber, plywood, &  insulation thickness and whatever else down to the RV's ceiling. And the rafter thickness. I think if I could picture what's really there it might help me figure out what I am really doing.

BTW, I wonder what type of plywood that is that can support my weight, but is softer than cardboard when I try to screw into it.

-Don- SSF, CA​
 
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