RV Newbie - All Opinions Appreciated

[dagnabit9]

First of all, let me introduce myself.  I am a retired military member (AF) living in New Mexico who is looking to purchase a toy hauler to transport our, and possibly a friends, motorcycle to various places in the US.

I have a 2006 Ford F-250 CC 4WD 6.0L TD with a regular bed (6.5 feet) for a tow vehicle.  If I read it right, the book says it will tow 15,500 lbs as is.

Now comes the real test of human endurance - interfacing with the salespeople!  One says "we have the best product and best service in the industry" and another down the road says "there are 18 master technicians in the state and we have 11 of them in our service department".  Most bash the competitions' product to the point of "I usually don't say anything about so and so, but I would look real close at them because they have some issues you should know about".

I've read enough of the threads in this forum to find out you don't take to heart ANYTHING the salespeople say - so, who do you trust?  Is there a bonafide, reliable source to get unbiased information from that you can believe?

- Jon

 

[Ray D]

Is there a bonafide, reliable source to get unbiased information from that you can believe?

You have found it. This is the place. Lots of expertise on any RV related subject. No axes to grind. No profit to be made. No personal stake in what you decide to do. No better place, anywhere.

I come here for my answers. Very satisfied.

Ask your questions. They will be along shortly.

Ray D  ;D

 

[dagnabit9]

OK, here goes...

Is there any manufacturers out there that I should absolutely stay away from?  The wife and I have been looking at Weekend Warrior, Dutchmen, and Raptor TTs and Fifth Wheels and really don't know one manufacturer from another.  Here in Albuquerque there seems to be a abundance of RV dealerships so I suspect I will see many more manufacturers out there before we pull the trigger on the one we like.

I have a preference of a fifth wheel over a TT mainly for the stability and room issues; is there any redeeming quality of a TT over a fifth wheel when it comes to a toy hauler?

Also, can you tow a trailer on the back end of a fifth wheel?  I suppose I should do a bit of research on this issue as different states might have different stands on this...

- Jon

 

[Ron]

Personally I have never been favorable impressed with Thor products.  I have never owned one but then that is because I never felt they were all that good.  Some folks I am sure like them.

 

[Woody]

IMO Dutchman is on the low end of RV's, again, that is just my opinion. Since many people are getting rid of their RV's due to high cost of gas you might want to look at used units as opposed to new. You can get a higher end product at less cost and someone else has already had to work out the "bugs" that are prevalent in all new units.

Woody

 

[Ron]

Good point Woody.  Just remember Thor products are not in the group suggested when looking at higher end RV/s.

 

[Carl L]

I've read enough of the threads in this forum to find out you don't take to heart ANYTHING the salespeople say - so, who do you trust?  Is there a bonafide, reliable source to get unbiased information from that you can believe?

- Jon

No one and no.

You trust only what you can see and read from externally constrained sources (info on DOT plates for example) or what you measure and calculate yourself or where you can follow the calcs yourself.

You can listen to opinions here but realize they are just that.  In the final picture only you know your situation and your deal and the compromises you want to make.

 

[Woody]

Hi Ron,

Maybe I should have worded my reply differently. I wasn't suggesting that he could get a used Thor product. I looked at 5th. wheel trailers before I finally bought my used MH. My 1/2 ton PU just wasn't big enough to pull the size trailer I wanted. Even though gas prices have gone to he.. in a handbasket I'm still glad I bought a MH instead of a 5th wheel.

Woody

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Most of us on the staff here have a low opinion of Dutchman products, but it is just an opinion and few of us have ever actually owned one. I've looked at a few new and used and was unimpressed with the materials, fit and finish and design, but the price level is attractive too. And price is nearly always a factor in any big purchase decision like this. Unless you won the Powerball Lotto recently, that is.

If you will use the trailer extensively, then it is worthwhile to spend more to get more quality and livability. How much more only you can decide.

 

[Tom]

I've never owned a Dutchman, nor have I expressed any opinion on one.

 

[janpaul]

OK, here goes...

Is there any manufacturers out there that I should absolutely stay away from?  The wife and I have been looking at Weekend Warrior, Dutchmen, and Raptor TTs and Fifth Wheels and really don't know one manufacturer from another.  Here in Albuquerque there seems to be a abundance of RV dealerships so I suspect I will see many more manufacturers out there before we pull the trigger on the one we like

- Jon

You mentioned Raptor, FWIW, we have one and love it. We have had no major issues that I could not resolve myself. Just be careful of your weight limitations, the larger Raptors will be too much for that truck. Look around on the web also, there are so many mfgs. and models out there that you will surely find one that will suit your needs.

 

[dagnabit9]

Some of the salespeople are trying to sell us the biggest darn trailer they have on the lot, e.g., 35 foot, 38 foot, 41 foot and I am a little bit leary (sp?) of pulling that length of trailer with that truck.  That being said, however, am I correct is stating the max towing weight of that truck is 15,500 lbs?  I looked it up in one of the RV mags websites where it lists all the makes, models and such.  Do I have to subtract anything for altitude, driving conditions, weather, etc., etc.?

 

[Ron]

I would never believe a salesman.  Do your own calculations or ask for help here.  The normal is to subtract 10% unless you will towing in the West then subtract 20%.

 

[Woody]

Somewhere inside your truck there should be a sticker that lists the GVWR. On my Chev it is on the inside of the glove box door but I don't know where it is on your Ford. Many things besides the size of the truck effect the GVWR, such as motor size, transmission, rear axles ratio, etc.

Woody

 

[dagnabit9]

OK, here's more information on my truck.  As I said earlier, it is a 2006 F-250 CC standard bed with a 6.0L TD with standard whells and tires.  GVWR (listed on the driver's door) is 10,000 lbs, RGAWR is 6,200 lbs.  According to Ford, conventional towing capacity is 12,500 lbs; fifth whell towing capacity is 15,500 lbs; and GCWR is 23,000 lbs.  With these figures, I should be able to calculate whether or not a specific trailer or fifth wheel can be towed safely, right??

 

[Carl L]

OK, here's more information on my truck.  As I said earlier, it is a 2006 F-250 CC standard bed with a 6.0L TD with standard whells and tires.  GVWR (listed on the driver's door) is 10,000 lbs, RGAWR is 6,200 lbs.  According to Ford, conventional towing capacity is 12,500 lbs; fifth whell towing capacity is 15,500 lbs; and GCWR is 23,000 lbs.  With these figures, I should be able to calculate whether or not a specific trailer or fifth wheel can be towed safely, right??

Yup.  It is all there.  Use the trailer GVWR.  Dry weight is meaningless.  Since the truck is a turbo, you do not pay the altitude penalty that a gasser faces out West (3% of rated HP per 1000 feet of altitude).    Use a 10% safety factor to discount the tow rating in order to account for truck cargo, state of tune, wear on brakes, etc..  With a 5th wheel watch that GRAWR vs the pin weight of the trailer -- especially with a F250 SRW.

 

[dagnabit9]

Thanks for all the help, Carl.  So, I guess what you're saying is make sure the TT is no heavier than 12,500 lbs (minus 10%) or the 5er is no heavier than 15,500 (minus 10%) while paying attention to the GRAWR of 6,200 pounds, an overall rig weight of 23,000 lbs and not load the truck more than 10,000 lbs (GVWR).  Not sure if I've got it or not, the numbers are REALLY confusing sometimes...

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

I checked your truck in the 2006 Ford Towing Guide, which is Ford's own publication. It shows 12,500 lbs for conventional towing on  an F250, regardless of configuration. For fifth wheel towing with an automatic transmission the Crew Cab diesel is rated at 15,900 for a 4x2 and 15,400 for a 4x4.

The rear axle GAWR is likely to be the limiting factor in what you can tow - you will likely exceed that in fifth wheel pin weight before you exceed the GCWR of 23,000 lbs.

 

[janpaul]

Thanks for all the help, Carl.  So, I guess what you're saying is make sure the TT is no heavier than 12,500 lbs (minus 10%) or the 5er is no heavier than 15,500 (minus 10%) while paying attention to the GRAWR of 6,200 pounds, an overall rig weight of 23,000 lbs and not load the truck more than 10,000 lbs (GVWR).  Not sure if I've got it or not, the numbers are REALLY confusing sometimes...

One thing I did (per Carl L's advice) was purchase a Sherline scale which will allow you to check the pin weight. It really makes a difference in how you load it. Our 5er has a GVWR of 14,400, but that is cargo section full and carrying water. When fully loaded last time I weighed it was 11,700# and pin was 1900#. The best way to check is to actually weigh it. I did that before I signed the papers to purchase, so I knew for myself it was going to be legal and safe. I told the dealer I wanted to do this and they had no problem, as there was a CAT scale 3 miles from them. I took  advice from experts here and everything worked out well, you are heading in the right direction. Also, load your truck how you would be when towing and weigh it, that way you will know how much it, and each axle weighs. A little common sense goes a long way.

 

[N Smock]

Gary nailed it. The tow limt is really restricted by the pin weiight. With the toy haulers you will lighten the pin weight with the toys in the rear. Just a note to consider if purchasing new, look at the axel capacity vs trailer GVW, it might be desirable to get the trailer with a heavier axel than factory standard.