Browning42
Member
I'm upgrading to 5er weighing in around 12,000lbs dry. Thoughts on a DRW or a SRW? Are there any states that have laws on this?
Single rear wheel or Double rear wheel?
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Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
No specific laws for private vehicles, but you need enough truck payload capacity to carry the trailer pin weight plus passengers in the truck. A 12,000 lb dry trailer will gross somewhere around 15,000 lbs and the pin weight will be in the range of 3000-3700 lbs. You will almost surely need dual rear wheels (a dually) to get that much carrying capacity.
OP
OP
Browning42
Member
A SRW 3500 will be more than enough for payload, my concerns are having to replace 6 tires vice 4 tires, I'm not the standard all season kinda guy for tires. There's also the extra fuel cost when we're not towing.
steveblonde
Well-known member
2015 chevy
4264 lbs srw payload 4x4 crew cab duramax regular box 17100 lbs 5th wheel towing
5205 lbs dually 4x4 payload 22600lbs 5th wheel towing
me my trailer is 13000lbs empty 1000llbs cargo 190 lbs of fuel (its a toy hauler with a generator)
800lbs water (96 gal water tank) which i very very rarely fill = 15000lbs so im about 14200lbs - 14500lbs with everything for 2 weeks
me 2013 chevy 1ton LTZ Duramax SRW
2015 voltage 3305
ps i see guys all the time pulling my size trailer with 3/4tons that have air bags - not saying its right - but just saying
4264 lbs srw payload 4x4 crew cab duramax regular box 17100 lbs 5th wheel towing
5205 lbs dually 4x4 payload 22600lbs 5th wheel towing
me my trailer is 13000lbs empty 1000llbs cargo 190 lbs of fuel (its a toy hauler with a generator)
800lbs water (96 gal water tank) which i very very rarely fill = 15000lbs so im about 14200lbs - 14500lbs with everything for 2 weeks
me 2013 chevy 1ton LTZ Duramax SRW
2015 voltage 3305
ps i see guys all the time pulling my size trailer with 3/4tons that have air bags - not saying its right - but just saying
Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
I stand corrected re the need for a dually to get the required payload! Just make sure the rear axle GAWR is also ok.
I would avoid the dually if not needed for rear axle weight capacity and payload. There is some merit to the argument that a dually has more stability when trailering, and this may be noticeable in strong crosswinds, but I think that is substantially outweighed by other factors, e.g. tire expense, lower mpg, greater width to park, and higher initial cost.
I would avoid the dually if not needed for rear axle weight capacity and payload. There is some merit to the argument that a dually has more stability when trailering, and this may be noticeable in strong crosswinds, but I think that is substantially outweighed by other factors, e.g. tire expense, lower mpg, greater width to park, and higher initial cost.
steveblonde
Well-known member
Gary is correct - duallies are nice no doubt i had one back in 08 but they also have a down side as Gary says - parking, added fuel costs, tires etc etc and with all the new trucks Ford Dodge GM they all come with some sort of Automatic Trailer Sway Control system - Do You Need one probably not they are nice to have for sure but if your not towing 100% of the time or on a farm you probably don't need one.
side note - some states and provinces are starting to crack down on over weight vehicles ie pulling a 17000lb trailer with a 3/4 ton and overloading the box pin weight notably British Columbia and the cost difference on a 3/4 ton to a 1 ton is only a couple hundred bucks the same with a 1 ton SRW and a dually
side note - some states and provinces are starting to crack down on over weight vehicles ie pulling a 17000lb trailer with a 3/4 ton and overloading the box pin weight notably British Columbia and the cost difference on a 3/4 ton to a 1 ton is only a couple hundred bucks the same with a 1 ton SRW and a dually
In the SRW vs DRW issue, the pin weight is the problem. Single rear wheel trucks of today have plenty of torque and horsepower for towing. But single rear wheel back axle housings and their components just don't have the weight carrying capabilities for 3K or more.
The axle diameter and gears in the Dual Rear Wheel trucks are capable of handling increased weights on the beds/hitches.
When I bought a fifth wheel trailer to pull behind my 3/4 ton diesel pickup, I limited myself to 11K dry weight and 2K dry pin weight. And when I first hooked up, no squat at all was detected. My mid weight trailer serves my needs exactly, and my truck pulls it great.
If a "full size" fifth wheel trailer was in my future, I would have to trade for a 1 ton dual rear wheel truck.
The axle diameter and gears in the Dual Rear Wheel trucks are capable of handling increased weights on the beds/hitches.
When I bought a fifth wheel trailer to pull behind my 3/4 ton diesel pickup, I limited myself to 11K dry weight and 2K dry pin weight. And when I first hooked up, no squat at all was detected. My mid weight trailer serves my needs exactly, and my truck pulls it great.
If a "full size" fifth wheel trailer was in my future, I would have to trade for a 1 ton dual rear wheel truck.
steveblonde
Well-known member
my pin is 2800 my payload is 4264 that leaves 1464 me and wife and 2 100lb dogs (boxers really big ones lol they actually weight 90 and 75lbs but i round up ) + hitch 160lbs leaves about 725 lbs so im close but not over max pull weight is 17100 im actually at 14500most trips but MAX trailer weight 15200 if i'm carrying water which is rare (twice maybe 3 times a year and its just short trips 100 miles or so) and most of the time wife is pulling the boat with the other truck (so i have about 1000lbs to play with wife 2 dogs plus 725lbs)
robertusa123
Well-known member
In some areas like long island. Dull rear wheels make your pickup a comerical truck. despite having privet plates. Thue making over 1/2 the roads and bridges a no go zone.
Mopar1973Man
Well-known member
Lo of people make another mistake. They look at the GAWR on the door. Like mine states...
Front - 5,200
Rear - 6.084
Total - 8,800
You do not get to play with the full 6,084 minus the scaled rear axle. Because if you add 5,200 and 6,084 together that's 11,284 which is over the GVWR. So to be proper you have to scale your truck and then figure out remaining weight with the 8,800. So my front is scaled at 4,440 so that means I've got a 4,360 carry capacity on the rear axle. (Calculated with the 8,800 GVWR). But my rear axle is already carrying 3,200 pounds so now subtract that from 4,360 and you get 1,160 worth of pin weight I can play with. Doesn?t leave much for me to play with but I will now exceed either GVWR or the GAWR.
Front - 5,200
Rear - 6.084
Total - 8,800
You do not get to play with the full 6,084 minus the scaled rear axle. Because if you add 5,200 and 6,084 together that's 11,284 which is over the GVWR. So to be proper you have to scale your truck and then figure out remaining weight with the 8,800. So my front is scaled at 4,440 so that means I've got a 4,360 carry capacity on the rear axle. (Calculated with the 8,800 GVWR). But my rear axle is already carrying 3,200 pounds so now subtract that from 4,360 and you get 1,160 worth of pin weight I can play with. Doesn?t leave much for me to play with but I will now exceed either GVWR or the GAWR.
I see your from NB. Maybe New Brunswick or Nebraska ??Browning42 said:
The only legal weights issue here in the states can be exceeding a axle/tire load rating...especially the rear axle (RAWR) as its carrying 99 percent of the trailers hitch weight.
And your state or province may have some kind of a max weight for registering purposes. It will only be enforced in your state/province as some states like mine has no weight(s) to register our private use trucks.
GVWR isn't a player in how much load a truck can carry "legally".
Like my state dot captain says " a S10 may pull a 40' Teton as long as axle/tire load ratings aren't exceeded".
I see on Fleet Fords body service website some (not all) F350 SRW 6.7 diesel have up to 4200-4300 lb payloads. If your going with a F350 SRW choose the package that will give you the higher payloads.
Be warned Ford markets some of the F350 SRW at a 10000 GVWR up to a 11200 GVWR in the same exact truck.
On another rv forum we had a new member that didn't know he had bought one with a 10000 GVWR. The forums weight police types convinced him he had to make a costly trade for the same truck F350 SRW only it had the 11200 GVWR.
Choose carefully.
Mopar1973Man
Well-known member
I might be...
GVWR is stated for a reason. But like my example above if I was able to load to full axle weight I would be at 4,440 + 6,084 = 10,524 pounds (1,724 Over). Then I would be capable of hauling a much larger RV by a long shot. Being my rear axle scaled is 3,200 right now so that would give me 2,884 pin weight.
But when I use this calculator
http://changingears.com/rv-sec-calc-trailer-weight-fw.shtml
I get the same same numbers as I mathed out in my post above. So most calculator tend to include the math to stay within the GVWR.
So you saying above quote that we can also ignore the GVWR on the trailer to and go by the axle rating? ???
Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
Be careful - some of those numbers may be a for a chassis cab, i.e. no pick-up bed. I don't see anything in the 2015 Ford Superduty Trailer Guide that shows payloads of 4000+ lbs for an F350 SRW diesel pick-up body.
http://www.ford.com/resources/ford/general/pdf/towingguides/15RV&TT_Ford_SuperDtyPU_r1_Jan12.pdf
steveblonde
Well-known member
Be careful - some of those numbers may be a for a chassis cab, i.e. no pick-up bed. I don't see anything in the 2015 Ford Superduty Trailer Guide that shows payloads of 4000+ lbs for an F350 SRW diesel pick-up body.
http://www.ford.com/resources/ford/general/pdf/towingguides/15RV&TT_Ford_SuperDtyPU_r1_Jan12.pdf
Gary is correct on this - its one of the big reasons i went with a chevy - because of the added weight capacity without getting a dually - having said that the "new" 2016 ford should be differant again
http://www.ford.com/resources/ford/general/pdf/towingguides/15RV&TT_Ford_SuperDtyPU_r1_Jan12.pdf
Gary is correct on this - its one of the big reasons i went with a chevy - because of the added weight capacity without getting a dually - having said that the "new" 2016 ford should be differant again
The clicky is Fords towing guide numbers. The only weight numbers were for a truck camper loading. However even the clicky shows a 4x4 SRW reg cab with 18"/20" tires 137" wb 6.7 diesel 11500 GVWR with a 4053 lb capacity.
Camper loading weights in the towing guide are different than GVWR payloads on Fords Body Service website https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas/topics/2015/15_SD_Pickups_SB_Updates.pdf
Scroll down to pages 74/75/76/77 where it gives payloads for each configured truck. Lots of 4k plus payloads on the F350 SRW pickup
Camper loading weights in the towing guide are different than GVWR payloads on Fords Body Service website https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas/topics/2015/15_SD_Pickups_SB_Updates.pdf
Scroll down to pages 74/75/76/77 where it gives payloads for each configured truck. Lots of 4k plus payloads on the F350 SRW pickup
steveblonde
Well-known member
justa note Ford is saying the NEW 2015 F150 will pull 12200 lbs with a 3000 lb load capacity in a 1/2 ton so what the 3/4 and 1 ton will do who knows
