Yet another electrical bonding question

[Armin]

A few of years ago I purchased a used 2005 K-Z Jag 21Q travel trailer. Love the interior layout and everything else about it. However... the original owner had installed solar panels and the associated electronics, which were subsequently removed before I bought the trailer from them. All 12v and 110v systems worked fine and the battery charged correctly while plugged the unit into shore power.

Last year I bought Honda EU1000i generator. When I plugged the trailer's shore power cable into the generator all 110v electrical appliances worked fine but the batteries would not charge (They do charge when plugged into shore power). While plugged into the generator I checked the output of the charger and sure enough, no power going to the batteries. I then had a look at the 110v side of the panel and noticed that the incomming neutral wire was attached to the ground bus bar. This seemed odd to me so I consulted with an RV repair technician who told me the neutral needed to go to the neutral bus bar, not to ground. I remedied the problem and everything worked fine. The batteries would now charge.

A few days ago I made the dumb mistake of running over the shore power cable with my lawnmower... neatly cutting the cable in half. :-[
I obtained a new cable and while removing the old cable today I noticed the old cable's ground and neutral wires were tied together inside the trailer's junction box. The hot (black) wire was tied to the trailer's hot. The white (neutral) and green (ground) wires were both tied to the trailer's white wire. The trailer's ground wire was tied down to the the junction box's ground connector which I assume attaches it to the trailer chassis. The trailer's 110v wire then runs to the WFCO electrical panel.

I connected the new cable in the same manner and everything works fine but after much searching and reading on this forum and other places on the net regarding bonding of neutral/ground in trailers I'm now wondering if this the proper way to connect it. I'm worried that when the solar system was pulled from trailer the wiring may have been messed up by the person who removed it. Not sure if it matters but there is no inverter in the trailer, only a WFCO 30amp converter/power centre with a 3-stage battery charger.

The nearest competent RV technician is a 6 hour drive away from where I live.

Any opinions/advice on this would be greatly appreciated.

 

[teddyu]

The white and green cable in the power cord should not be tied (bonded).  The shore power bond is achieved at the campground pedestal or main circuit breaker panel.  I would split the shore power cable white and green conductors.  The white should go only to the neutral buss and the green should be connected to the ground buss in the main RV panel.  JM2?...

 

[buchanan]

A few of years ago I purchased a used 2005 K-Z Jag 21Q travel trailer. Love the interior layout and everything else about it. However... the original owner had installed solar panels and the associated electronics, which were subsequently removed before I bought the trailer from them. All 12v and 110v systems worked fine and the battery charged correctly while plugged the unit into shore power.

Last year I bought Honda EU1000i generator. When I plugged the trailer's shore power cable into the generator all 110v electrical appliances worked fine but the batteries would not charge (They do charge when plugged into shore power). While plugged into the generator I checked the output of the charger and sure enough, no power going to the batteries. I then had a look at the 110v side of the panel and noticed that the incomming neutral wire was attached to the ground bus bar. This seemed odd to me so I consulted with an RV repair technician who told me the neutral needed to go to the neutral bus bar, not to ground. I remedied the problem and everything worked fine. The batteries would now charge.

A few days ago I made the dumb mistake of running over the shore power cable with my lawnmower... neatly cutting the cable in half. :-[
I obtained a new cable and while removing the old cable today I noticed the old cable's ground and neutral wires were tied together inside the trailer's junction box. The hot (black) wire was tied to the trailer's hot. The white (neutral) and green (ground) wires were both tied to the trailer's white wire. The trailer's ground wire was tied down to the the junction box's ground connector which I assume attaches it to the trailer chassis. The trailer's 110v wire then runs to the WFCO electrical panel.

I connected the new cable in the same manner and everything works fine but after much searching and reading on this forum and other places on the net regarding bonding of neutral/ground in trailers I'm now wondering if this the proper way to connect it. I'm worried that when the solar system was pulled from trailer the wiring may have been messed up by the person who removed it. Not sure if it matters but there is no inverter in the trailer, only a WFCO 30amp converter/power centre with a 3-stage battery charger.

The nearest competent RV technician is a 6 hour drive away from where I live.

Any opinions/advice on this would be greatly appreciated.

two things come to mind.IF it charges on SP and U use the exact same power cord and plug into the gen set then it has to charge also.Has to!! assuming its all as advertised here.Second off G+W hooked together is not accepted electrical practise but when push come,s  to shove everything will work fine except GFI breakers.

 

[boatbuilder]

The green and white should only be tied together at a source of power, ie. shore power pedestal or breaker box, generator or inverter. This is a standard on boats and should be the same for an RV.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Definitely split the neutral and ground in the trailer-side junction box. It is a violation of the electrical code and will cause a problem if you ever plug into a shore outlet that is GFCI protected (the GFCI will trip immediately).

 

[buchanan]

Definitely split the neutral and ground in the trailer-side junction box. It is a violation of the electrical code and will cause a problem if you ever plug into a shore outlet that is GFCI protected (the GFCI will trip immediately).

yes as I said gfi wont work this way but standard breaker will. its not really as dangerous as some make it sound but its definitely not  by code when wired together after main source.

 

[NY_Dutch]

Bonding the neutral and ground at the coach also leaves you vulnerable to a dreaded "hot chassis" if the outlet has been mis-wired with a reversed neutral and hot. Grabbing a hot aluminum door frame while standing on wet ground is not the stuff that long lives are made of. Reversed outlets are uncommon, but they do occur from time to time, especially when untrained personnel are allowed to do electrical maintenance at a campground.

 

[Armin]

First, thanks for all the quick answers. So glad I found this forum... what a great group of people and what a great resource!

Just to help clarify this (I'm slow to catch on sometimes ), if I connect the shore power cable's incoming green (ground) wire to the trailer wiring's bare copper (ground) wire inside the junction box, I believe it will also be tied to the trailer's chassis/frame. I this OK since the 12v ground from the battery and from my truck's trailer wiring also attaches to the trailer's frame.

Thanks again for all the great help.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Yes, both the 12v ground and the 120vac ground (which are two different things with the same name) should be connected to the trailer frame. Make sure that bare wire in the junction box actually goes there (you can check continuity to the frame with an ohmmeter).

 

[Armin]

Thanks! 

 

[John From Detroit]

That word "Ground" trips up many people .. There is Ground (Meaning Earth Ground) and "Ground" meaning "Chassis ground" and "Ground" meaning Safety ground.

In a motor home the last two are the same.

Bonding, is another word that causes confusion.. In a 120 volt system, Bonding, as used here, NORMALLY means earth/safety ground to neutral and this happens ONLY at the service entrance or in the specific case of an RV park the service OUTLET (The park power pedestal)  But it means other things to other people, myself included

The Bottom Line:

Gary spoke the truth.  Hook it up as he said and do not worry about it.

 

[Armin]

Thanks, John!

 

[keymastr]

there are occasional deaths from shore power pedestals being miswired in just this manner. Last year some kids died swimming next to a dock that had been wired this way. Serious business.