Exhaust brake

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davidsimmonds

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Joined
Sep 17, 2005
Posts
58
Location
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
I have a 2005 Dodge 2500 Diesel automatic four door RWD. Mopar markets an exhaust brake made by Jacobs ('Jake Brake' fame). However, they will only install it on manual transmissions or 2006+ automatic transmissions. Something to do with the auto transmission not communicating properly. Whatever. I have been told that if I put ANY exhaust brake on the vehicle, the warranty will likely be voided. What's up with this? Do any exhaust brake manufacturers have a device for my truck that won't void the warranty? Anyone have any experience with this stuff?

I'll be pulling a 2005/2006 Wildcat 30LSWB with a dry weight of 8,160lbs and GVWR of 11,620lbs. From what I can tell, an exhaust brake would be very helpful in addition to a Tekonsha Prodigy Brake Control.
 

Gary RV_Wizard

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At my Silver Springs FL home
Yes, an exhaust brake is highly desirable for your rig. Unfortunately, Dodge has experienced excessive automatic transmission failures when using exhaust brakes (including the one they themselves used to sell/recommend), so they stopped the practice a couple years back by saying that use of an engine brake would void the tranny warranty.  The tranny (torque converter) could not handle the back pressure from the engine when the exhaust brake engages. Nothing the exhaust brake manufacturer can do or say about it - it's a tranny problem. Apparently Chrysler Corp has beefed up the tranny for 2006, so it is once again OK.
 

Bill_Frisbee

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Joined
Jul 2, 2005
Posts
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Location
Guelph, Ontario
The following is a discussion re this topic (several of my own contributions) on the Montana Owners Club Forum.

To Mods:

Apologies for the long post. Would have just posted the URL but you need to be a MOC member to access the Forum. Thought this was easier. Delete if necessary.

Bill


Posted - Jan 20 2006 :  4:56:50 PM 
Dodge just came out with an warranty approved jacob exhaust brake for the Dodge 2006 Automatic.

I contacted Jacob the makers of this exhaust brake and they suggested that all the owners of older Dodge automatic's take the time to contact www.Dodge.com and express our desire for them to produce a RETRO KIT for the older automatic's.

So, while your sitting there having you cup of coffee, pull up www.Dodge.com you will need the last eight numbers of your trucks VIN for the form..IT'S WORTH A SHOT. they should either give us a RETRO KIT, or approve an aftermarket exhaust brake for our Dodge's

HELP- Thanks Guy's John H (aka Hemlockusa)
2005 Dodge 3500 4x2 Dually Cummings Diesel, Line X /2005 Montana 3650RK


Bill Frisbee
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MOC-4493

Canada
67 Posts

Posted - Jan 21 2006 :  6:45:48 PM  Show Profile  Email Poster  Edit Reply Send Bill Frisbee a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Reply
The text below was forwarded to me by the General Manager (Dave) of the Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep dealership from whom I bought my 2005 Ram 3500 with the automatic transmission. The email was received from the Fleet Service Operations Manager via one of his staff in response to my inquiry re installation of an engine brake on my Ram 3500. I know the Fleet Manager personally, he hauls a 2004 Montana 3400RL with a 2005 Ram 2500 with the automatic transmission. His recommendation was a significant reason why we ended up buying a Monty 3400 of our own. Hope the email is enlightening if not especially helpful. BTW, I have decided to go without the exhaust brake. If we ever buy another TV, I will be more knowledgeable about such matters!

References to speed in Km/hour and metrage reflect the fact that I live in Canada!

Bill

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


Dave

I have reviewed the trailer tow ratings and the only reference I can find to an exhaust brake is for a manual transmission towing over 10,000 lbs. This vehicle has a trailer tow rating of 15,800 with 3.73 gears while a 3500 automatic has a tow rating of 13,850 with 3.73 and 15,850 with 4.10 ratio.
The computer on a 2005 does not have the drivers to activate an exhaust brake but it does have the shift logic. If the cruise control is set and you are descending a grade when the set speed is exceeded by a few Km. the transmission will downshift to assist braking. Even if you apply the brakes which deactivates the cruise the computer will still downshift to assist braking. Sorry I don't know the exact metrage over the set speed that the computer down shifts
I recently went through the mountains in West Virginia, Virginia etc and found the amount a engine braking to be very adequate. I'm sure an exhaust brake would provide additional braking but with the torque converter in the equation it would be marginal.



Fleet Service Operations Specialist


BEAUTY: 2005 Montana 3400RL
THE BEAST:2005 Dodge Ram 3500 Laramie Pkg, 4X4, SRW, Cummins Turbo Diesel, Short Box, PullRite 16K Super Glide.
Guelph, Ontario


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Hemlockusa
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MOC-4766

USA
64 Posts

Posted - Jan 21 2006 :  11:58:18 PM  Show Profile  Email Poster Send Hemlockusa a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Bill - I appreciate your INPUT, and the attached memo from DAVE. I guess I am hoping that if enough of us complain Dodge would at least consider a retro kit or at the very least research and approve an after market exhaust brake that would not void our warranty.... I think it is in part a SAFEY ISSUE for those who two the heaver RV's. Thanks again and to anyone else who would care to put their 2 cents in..

Later John H (aka Hemlockusa)
2005 Dodge 3500 4x2 Dually Cummings Diesel, Line X /2005 Montana 3650RK

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Bill Frisbee
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MOC-4493

Canada
67 Posts

Posted - Jan 22 2006 :  9:53:29 PM  Show Profile  Email Poster  Edit Reply Send Bill Frisbee a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Reply
Hi, John ...

I totally agree about the safety issue ... and apparently DaimlerChrysler does as well. Too bad they do not find it necessary to make or provide a product that fulfills their own stated requirements ... and too bad that DC does not tell their sales people to inform customers of this "minor" problem with 2005 models. The sales person with whom I dealt knew exactly what I intended to pull with the 3500 (that is why I bought the 3500 instead of the 2500) and never said a word. I actually gave them the exact specifications of the Monty 3400.

The following information came to my attention as a result of a discussion on another forum, long after I had purchased both the Monty and the Ram 3500. It was not provided by the dealer ... and in fact came as news to them!

"Exhaust Brake ... requirement

An exhaust brake ... is REQUIRED for
Dodge 3500 Pickup and chassis cab
models pulling a trailer weight of 10,000
pounds or more."

-2005 Trailer Towing Guide
(from DaimlerChrysler)*

My big concern is what happens in the event of an accident when some insurance adjuster decides it could have been prevented if my truck had an engine brake installed? My insurance company refuses to pay because I do not have the engine brake installed that the manufacturer says is required. The manufacturer refuses to assume responsibility, arguing that I should not have been hauling more than 10,000 lbs. Guess who is stuck???

Bill

BEAUTY: 2005 Montana 3400RL
THE BEAST:2005 Dodge Ram 3500 Laramie Pkg, 4X4, SRW, Cummins Turbo Diesel, Short Box, PullRite 16K Super Glide.
Guelph, Ontario


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Montana Sky
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MOC-889

USA
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Posted - Jan 22 2006 :  10:10:12 PM  Show Profile  Email Poster  Visit Montana Sky's Homepage Send Montana Sky a Private Message  Reply with Quote
In terms of your insurance company they are going to look at the amount of weight you are towing at the time of the accident. They are more concerned about if you had over loaded the trailer, are you over the GCVWR and so on. They look into the hitch you have in your truck, is it enough to handle the load you were hauling. They are not as concerned with what type of modifications you have installed in your truck as much as are you within the WEIGHT LIMITS of the truck. If you follow the limits Dodge put on your Ram, you will be fine.

2004 Chevy Silverado LT 2500HD CrewCab Duramax
2004 Montana 3400RL
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KC4KM
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MOC-3956

USA
30 Posts

Posted - Jan 23 2006 :  10:07:20 AM  Show Profile  Email Poster Send KC4KM a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Very interesting. I have a 2004 long bed, Quad Cab, DRW, and have noticed the problem. I used to drive Semi's. I know you are speaking about an '05 but I wonder how this applies to an '04 Model.
Bill & Jay Jay & 4 legged daughter "Molly" (12 Month old Shih Tzu)
2004 Dodge 3500 Dually 5.9 Turbo-Diesel Long Bed
2002 Montana 3295 RK
Travel-Air pin box
Reese 16K Hitch
Lap Top w/GPS
Aux. Fuel, Ham Gear HF,VHF, UHF & HF Amp
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Bill Frisbee
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MOC-4493

Canada
67 Posts

Posted - Jan 23 2006 :  6:19:53 PM  Show Profile  Email Poster  Edit Reply Send Bill Frisbee a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Reply
My understanding is that this problem applies to the 2004 models as well ... at least as far as Jacobs is concerned.


http://www.jakebrake.com/products/ld-exhaust.php

(See left margin for discussion of 2005 and earlier models)

The URL below is for U.S. Gear. They say they have a product that will work on 2004/2005 models but I fear that that may be inaccurate and/or may void the warranty on the Dodge if installed. Others (can't find the web site) have said that the transmission is not be able to handle the back pressure.


http://www.usgear.com/dcelerator.htm

Bill

BEAUTY: 2005 Montana 3400RL
THE BEAST:2005 Dodge Ram 3500 Laramie Pkg, 4X4, SRW, Cummins Turbo Diesel, Short Box, PullRite 16K Super Glide.
Guelph, Ontario


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KC4KM
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MOC-3956

USA
30 Posts

Posted - Jan 23 2006 :  10:05:36 PM  Show Profile  Email Poster Send KC4KM a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks, Bill, for the post. I checked out the URL's and it sure surprised me. I thought this was a simple thing. NOT ! there's as much to a Jake then there's in an engine. I think that I'll just wait and see what Dodge says. Many thanks for your input.

Bill
Bill & Jay Jay & 4 legged daughter "Molly" (12 Month old Shih Tzu)
2004 Dodge 3500 Dually 5.9 Turbo-Diesel Long Bed
2002 Montana 3295 RK
Travel-Air pin box
Reese 16K Hitch
Lap Top w/GPS
Aux. Fuel, Ham Gear HF,VHF, UHF & HF Amp
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