GM will stop building vehicles with tailpipes in 13 years and 11 months.

[lynnmor]

Yes, for sure. By far, in the USA, most EVs are in CA. So compare the charts.


The rest of the USA needs to catch of to CA's standards. Here in NV they soon will be. It's even in NV's state constitution to soon start doing such. 


-Don-  Reno, NV

Sure, do what CA does, shift electricity production to another state.

 

[Tom55555]

Sure, do what CA does, shift electricity production to another state.

I agree.

I really like being able to fill up our 55 gallon gas tank and 18 gallon propane tank. We can boondock for a long time.

In addition, my KLR650 motorcycle has a 6 gallon gas tank and a 300+ mile range which I can siphon from my RV tank.

 

[TheBar]

So why are we not talking about a hybrid RV which would be a relevant and practical topic to this forum? Couldn't the on-board generator be used to extend the range and burn much less fossil fuel, even if left running all the time? Why don't you tell us what a standard genset would add to the range and recharging times with it.

I would buy a hybrid car and RV. Hybrids solve most of the problems we been discussing.

 

[Lou Schneider]

So why are we not talking about a hybrid RV which would be a relevant and practical topic to this forum? Couldn't the on-board generator be used to extend the range and burn much less fossil fuel, even if left running all the time? Why don't you tell us what a standard genset would add to the range and recharging times with it.

Here are the recharging times and the resulting range in miles for each hour of charging time for a Tesla Model 3. I'd expect a big, boxy RV to use 2 to 4 times as much power as an aerodynamic Tesla to move down the road, so as a rough guess divide these Tesla recharging Miles/Hour (Column 3) by 2 to 4 for an RV.  First column is input power, e.g. 3.7 kw would be pretty much full output from a 4 Kw RV generator, giving 9-10 miles/hour range extension for a Tesla or 2-3 miles/hour for an RV.

For example, if a battery lets your RV covers 100 miles in two hours (twice the consumption of a Model 3), running a 4 Kw generator to recharge the onboard battery while underway will add about 8 miles to the range.

Empty to Full
3-pin plug Home                                               24 - 36 h 9 - 10 m/h
3.7kW       Home / Work                                 15 - 22 h 14 - 17 m/h
7kW         Home / Work / Public Location.      8 - 12 h 27 - 32 m/h
22kW       Work / Public Locations                   5 - 8 h 42 - 50 m/h

20%-80%
50kW       Public Locations                         40 - 60 min 96 - 113 m/30 min
150kW       Public Locations                         20 - 20 min 288 - 339 m/30 min 

 

https://pod-point.com/guides/vehicles/tesla/2021/model-3

Another factor to consider is a generator used to supply motive power will have to meet the exhaust standards for internal combustion propulsion engines, which most RV generators miss by huge amounts.

 

[Oldgator73]

So why are we not talking about a hybrid RV which would be a relevant and practical topic to this forum? Couldn't the on-board generator be used to extend the range and burn much less fossil fuel, even if left running all the time? Why don't you tell us what a standard genset would add to the range and recharging times with it.

I would buy a hybrid car and RV. Hybrids solve most of the problems we been discussing.

We purchased a Prius 20 years ago and loved it. Driving around town and on the AF base the gas motor would never kick in. The biggest problem was the lack of power which the Tesla certainly solves.

 

[1blue78]

Mine?  I live in BC so probably hydro.

Speaking of 'one and done'....have you heard of site C?  Have you seen the miles (kilometers) of the Peace valley that will be gone forever?  You enjoy your hydro while I reminisce about the most beautiful river valley that will soon be flooded - oh well I have photos to pass on...

 

[Tom55555]

Non technical people may not understand this link. Again, all you're doing is moving the air pollution somewhere else.

Solar and wind make up about 4%. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy

 

[docj]

Last week, I came over Donnor Summit when it was below 20F. I only used the seat heaters and that was warm enough for me. But I could have used the main heater if I wanted since it's only 99.0 miles from my house in Auburn, CA to here. The seat heaters use a lot less juice than the Tesla main heater.  I have yet to be in a situation where I have even needed the main heater or needed the range where I could not turn it on anyway.

-Don-  Reno, NV

People have been talking about range reduction while using heaters.  Here in south TX, needing heat is a couple of day a year issue.  What kind of range reduction occurs when the A/C is on all the time?  A/C's significantly reduce fuel economy on ICE vehicles.  They have to be a sizable drain on the batteries.  And don't tell me to open the windows!

 

[Oldgator73]

People have been talking about range reduction while using heaters.  Here in south TX, needing heat is a couple of day a year issue.  What kind of range reduction occurs when the A/C is on all the time?  A/C's significantly reduce fuel economy on ICE vehicles.  They have to be a sizable drain on the batteries.  And don't tell me to open the windows!

Use the 2/40 method. Two windows down/40 mph.  8)

 

[Tom55555]

Use the 2/40 method. Two windows down/40 mph.  8)

Lived in Dallas for two years servicing major companies in 115 degree weather in a van filled with electronic equipment wearing a suit and tie. I duck taped clear plastic behind the two front seats and it was still hot even with full AC. When I was able to work all day in IT departments for customers like Texas Instruments, EDS or Fort Hood, I loved it. 

 

[jymbee]

While these discussions are interesting we well as educational and arguments regarding things such as EV vs. petro are worthy of debate, at the same time I don't think enough attention is being paid to other long term considerations. In only around  five to eight billion years from now, give or take, the sun is expected to expand into a red giant during the throes of its death resulting in the total vaporization of the  Earth.

It will be interesting indeed to see how posters here will react as the development plays out...

Non technical people may not understand this link. Again, all you're doing is moving the air pollution somewhere else.

Solar and wind make up about 4%. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy

 

[Oldgator73]

While these discussions are interesting we well as educational and arguments regarding things such as EV vs. petro are worthy of debate, at the same time I don't think enough attention is being paid to other long term considerations. In only around  five to eight billion years from now, give or take, the sun is expected to expand into a red giant during the throes of its death resulting in the total vaporization of the  Earth.

It will be interesting indeed to see how posters here will react as the development plays out...

I want to see proof of this with citations.  8)

 

[docj]

Use the 2/40 method. Two windows down/40 mph.  8)

All kidding aside, IMHO opening windows in a south TX summer is a non-starter. 

What I'm asking is "with a 80-90F outside temperature, an A/C setting of 70 degrees and a road speed of 75 mph what would be the reduction in range for an EV?"  I'm not prepared to change my cruising speed or my comfort settings, so don't make those suggestions.  I suspect the range reduction is going to be large which is probably why it's rarely mentioned.

 

[Tom55555]

While these discussions are interesting we well as educational and arguments regarding things such as EV vs. petro are worthy of debate, at the same time I don't think enough attention is being paid to other long term considerations. In only around  five to eight billion years from now, give or take, the sun is expected to expand into a red giant during the throes of its death resulting in the total vaporization of the  Earth.

It will be interesting indeed to see how posters here will react as the development plays out...

It's actually 5 million years. LOL

 

[Mark_K5LXP]

No idea what the compressor motor is pulling in a Tesla, since it's not directly equivalent to a belt driven compressor in an ICE.  But, a WAG of 2HP average wouldn't be a stretch.  742 watts per HP so about 1.5kW which sounds plausible.  So subtract 1.5kWh from your battery capacity for every hour you're driving.  I think the smaller Tesla battery is about 70kWh.  If you spent 24 hours driving this could be a substantial reduction but there's only going to be so many hours you'll be in an EV before you run out of juice just from driving.  The EV I built had a 1kW resistive heater in it and it didn't affect daily operation one bit.  In fact I would often turn the heat on an hour before I left so I didn't have to scrape windows and it was nice and toasty inside.  Pretty sure the Tesla can turn on heat/AC while on charge for cabin pre-conditioning, so any of that you do while connected is that much less you initially draw while underway.  The traction motor is gobbling up kWh while the auxilliary loads are merely sipping Wh, so practically speaking the few percent reduction in range isn't a factor.  Wind and hills can influence range far more than heat or A/C.

Mark B.
Albuquerque, NM

 

[jymbee]

It's actually 5 million years. LOL

Uh-oh, no need to cause undo panic and exaggerate the timeline of our ultimate destruction! People need to know they can relax for awhile longer before the end comes...

But in about 5 billion years, the sun will run out of hydrogen. Our star is currently in the most stable phase of its life cycle and has been since the birth of our solar system, about 4.5 billion years ago. Once all the hydrogen gets used up, the sun will grow out of this stable phase.

https://tinyurl.com/y5wsrw9k

 

[Lou Schneider]

But think about how much more solar energy we'll be able to harvest in the final days!  Energy crisis solved (for a while).

 

[jymbee]

But think about how much more solar energy we'll be able to harvest in the final days!  Energy crisis solved (for a while).

Indeed. The ultimate good news, bad news scenario for sure!

 

[Tom55555]

Uh-oh, no need to cause undo panic and exaggerate the timeline of our ultimate destruction! People need to know they can relax for awhile longer before the end comes...

https://tinyurl.com/y5wsrw9k

You're right, it's 5 billion. A million used to be a lot, now it's billions and trillions. I wouldn't worry about it; we will probably be hit by a meteor before then. LOL

 

[Lowell]

Saw this on facebook today.  A gasoline powered van towing a diesel generator to recharge an electic car.