GM will stop building vehicles with tailpipes in 13 years and 11 months.

[Isaac-1]

Just curios, what ICE vehicle are you describing here with the 600 mile range?

My son's  2015 Volkswagen Golf Sportwagen TDI will do about 550-600 miles on a 13 gallon tank in open highway driving.  Until Covid hit he was commuting 112 miles per day 4-5 days per week in it, about 95 miles of which were open highway with 55-65 mph speed limit (mostly 65), the rest 35-40 mph stop and go city driving with a long term average of about 42-44 mpg.

 

[Larry N.]

Just curios, what ICE vehicle are you describing here with the 600 mile range?

Many DPs will do that. With my Beaver a few years back I once actually put 715 miles on one tank and still had 15-20 gallons left (150 gallon tank). It was a tad nerve racking, but a place to fuel it was hard to find in that area along the Columbia -- a 45 ft DP with a toad.

 

[NY_Dutch]

Just curios, what ICE vehicle are you describing here with the 600 mile range?

Even our 20 year old 34' gasser will go 600 miles on a full tank. 700 if I really want to push my luck...

 

[Tom55555]

I hope not.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0qDHt_9KmM&list=PLq-_cmf3H6yomU5rB6yOC5C9hr0Qnkf1l

https://www.ocregister.com/2020/08/23/the-blithering-idiocy-of-californias-energy-policies/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/ellenrwald/2019/10/10/do-californias-blackouts-signal-whats-in-store-for-all-americans/?sh=5aa37dd3162b

I agree.

 

[TheBar]

Just curios, what ICE vehicle are you describing here with the 600 mile range?

My Durango is rated at 25.6 mpg highway and my average at 65 mph is 25 mpg. When driving 75 mph I actually do better at 27 mpg. But 25 mpg times a 24 gallon tank = 600 miles. Back in 1997 my Pontiac Bonneville made 32 mpg highway average and had a 576 mile range. Way back in 1984 my dad's ocean liner Cadillac Coup? De Ville got 27 mpg with the A/C on and had a 567 mile range. If you don't believe it click here:

http://www.mpgbuddy.com/vehicle-profile/24493/eldorado.html

 

[Lou Schneider]

Except here in CA. The rest of the country needs to catch up with us.

You mean as in importing 32% of it's power from out of state?  Or as in getting half of the power it generates in-state from petroleum?  Or having almost 70% of it's generating capacity produce CO as a byproduct?

Of the power CA does produce for itself, 47% is petroleum based (natural gas), 11% comes from burning wood ("biomass"), 11% from hydro and 9% from nuclear energy.

That leaves 21% to be supplied by wind and solar power, both of which need an equivilent amount of conventional generating capacity to be on hot standby (spinning and burning fuel), ready to pick up the load when the wind dies down or a cloud passes overhead.  But that's out of the 68% of the power CA generates in-state, meaning it's only 14% of their total power usage.

So every time you "fill the tank" of an electric vehicle in CA, more than half of the energy is coming from hydrocarbon sources.  Up to 80% if you recharge overnight when solar power isn't available and wind is usually at a minimum.

Wikipedia couches their report in politically correct language, but you'll find the above if you read between the lines.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

However, expect the number of charge stations to almost double every year. But hopefully, they spread them out a lot better than they have been.

Where I really want to see more charge stations is out in the middle of nowhere. The large cities are covered, but that is about all.

There is no economic incentive to build charging stations where EVs are few. Nor is there much in the way of business or government priority. Rural regions lack all kinds of infrastructure, e.g. cellular service, internet access, public water supplies, and hospitals, to name a few. And sometimes gas stations are few and far between as well. 

 

[jymbee]

There is no economic incentive to build charging stations where EVs are few. Nor is there much in the way of business or government priority. Rural regions lack all kinds of infrastructure, e.g. cellular service, internet access, public water supplies, and hospitals, to name a few. And sometimes gas stations are few and far between as well. 

As one who lives in a very rural area I can testify to the lack of incentives to develop any kind of technologies in these areas where the RIO numbers are not favorable. Years ago I paid around twenty thousand bucks to install broadband in my home office given outfits like Time Warner had no incentive to expand in our area given the sparse population.

Flash forward a couple of decades and Time Warner has sold out to a local provider and today there's fiber optic cables up to and far beyond our house and everyone in the valley is online (fortunately I was able to recoup a good portion of my initial investment to get things that far!).

Did the provider make this kind of investment to provide service to so few out of the goodness of their heart? Hardly. The were able to take advantage of numerous incentives in the form of grants, and write offs offered by numerous agencies.

Early on having an Internet connection was something of a luxury. Over time, and up to the present, it's become clear that being connected is vitally important for multiple reasons (another discussion), hence the push to expand into less served areas.

I fully expect the establishment of EV facilities will follow a similar, if perhaps slower, path of development. What's rare today, will be taken for granted in the future. If anyone doubts this, please check back here in a hundred years so I can say  "I told you so".  ;D

 

[DonTom]

There is no economic incentive to build charging stations where EVs are few. Nor is there much in the way of business or government priority. Rural regions lack all kinds of infrastructure, e.g. cellular service, internet access, public water supplies, and hospitals, to name a few. And sometimes gas stations are few and far between as well. 

If every gas station was required to have just one charge station, that would solve much of the problem. They have electricity anyway and usually out in the middle of nowhere, parking isn't an issue.


J-1772 is slow, but it is cheap to install and every gas station already has the AC voltage available for such. And almost every EV made can use J-1772, including motorcycles. My three electric motorcycles as well as my Tesla can charge with J-1772.


In fact, if they would all just have a [font=ddg_proximanova, ddg_proximanova_ui_0, ddg_proximanova_ui_1, ddg_proximanova_ui_2, ddg_proximanova_ui_3, ddg_proximanova_ui_4, ddg_proximanova_ui_5, ddg_proximanova_ui_6, proxima nova, helvetica neue, helvetica, segoe ui, nimbus sans l, liberation sans, open sans, freesans, arial, sans-serif]NEMA 14-50R that EVs could use, that would pretty much solve the problem as most probably have the adapters anyway, as I do for all four of my EVs.[/font]

[font=ddg_proximanova, ddg_proximanova_ui_0, ddg_proximanova_ui_1, ddg_proximanova_ui_2, ddg_proximanova_ui_3, ddg_proximanova_ui_4, ddg_proximanova_ui_5, ddg_proximanova_ui_6, proxima nova, helvetica neue, helvetica, segoe ui, nimbus sans l, liberation sans, open sans, freesans, arial, sans-serif]-Don-  Auburn, CA[/font]

 

[DonTom]

You mean as in importing 32% of it's power from out of state?  you'll find the above if you read between the lines.

So we cheat a little . 


But it's not much of an issue, IMO to get it from a state much less populated than CA. Sure beats having this.




-Don-  Auburn, CA

 

[Viajeros]

I have nothing against EV's have considered buying one, and have even put down a $100 deposit on an Arcimoto (3 wheel 2 person electric motorcycle sort of thing) for when they go into general production.  I just feel that I am realist about the lack of electrical infrastructure to support the widespread adoption of such vehicles, and live in an area where the nearest charging station (excluding RV parks renting out 50 amp outlets) is 50 or more miles away in any direction, ie a Tesla supercharger station, as well as a couple of others in the city 50 miles south of here, a Tesla destination charger at a Holiday Inn Express 50 miles west, and another mix of charging stations including Tesla supercharger in the city 70 miles north east of here.  My problem and concern with the Arcimoto is one of range (102 miles at city driving speeds, less than 60 at highway speed)

The chances of you needing a Supercharger within 50 miles of you is pretty slim. Most Tesla owners rarely if ever use Superchargers. Charge at home. It?s much cheaper and much more convenient.

 

[DonTom]

The chances of you needing a Supercharger within 50 miles of you is pretty slim. Most Tesla owners rarely if ever use Superchargers. Charge at home. It?s much cheaper and much more convenient.

The EV he put a deposit on probably  cannot make 50 freeway miles. They don't even mention the freeway range on that, but I expect it is less than half the city range that they do advertise. So it's a legit concern in his case.


-Don-  Auburn, CA

 

[Rob&Deryl]

This has gotten silly.

The pissing back and forth about which tech is better for current cars isn?t really relevant to the possible future of electric powered RVs. Thirty years ago we could not foresee supercharger stations or even current day hybrids.

The personal attacks are getting tiring. I am stopping my viewing.

 

[Tom55555]

This has gotten silly.

The pissing back and forth about which tech is better for current cars isn?t really relevant to the possible future of electric powered RVs. Thirty years ago we could not foresee supercharger stations or even current day hybrids.

The personal attacks are getting tiring. I am stopping my viewing.

I didn't see any personal attacks. Great trading of ideas in my opinion.

My point is when you boondock, renewable energy is difficult.

Regarding dirt bikes, there's a reason why the United States of America Marines use the KLR650. I have the gas version.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRzP_NMIYrU

 

[Lowell]

United order 200 electric flying aircraft


https://www.msn.com/en-us/travel/news/united-airlines-orders-200-electric-vertical-aircraft/vi-BB1dzjj9?ocid=msedgdhp

 

[Tom55555]

United order 200 electric flying aircraft


https://www.msn.com/en-us/travel/news/united-airlines-orders-200-electric-vertical-aircraft/vi-BB1dzjj9?ocid=msedgdhp

60 mile range? Four people at $720?

By the time you would drive to the airport, go through security and board, I would already be there in my car. Now if you have an air pad on top of you're building or land and you live in LA you might save some time.

I don't want to sound cude but it didn't work out so well for Kobe Bryant. My wife thinks a 50 seat 80 million dollar jet is too small but she doesn't mind being on the back of my KLR650, go figure.

 

[NY_Dutch]

60 mile range? Four people at $720?

By the time you would drive to the airport, go through security and board, I would already be there in my car. Now if you have an air pad on top of you're building or land and you live in LA you might save some time.

I don't want to sound cude but it didn't work out so well for Kobe Bryant. My wife thinks a 50 seat 80 million dollar jet is too small but she doesn't mind being on the back of my KLR650, go figure.

The Kobe Bryant tragedy was due to the pilot violating fundamental visual flight rules...

 

[Tom55555]

I agree.

Flying in a small aircraft makes me nervous. I'll take a 727 or bigger any day because they are so expensive they typically have a pilot, copilot, sometimes a flight engineer and typically 3 or more flight attendants. The pilots are IFR, have back up and typically better instrumentation.
 

 

[Jayflight]

I agree.

Flying in a small aircraft makes me nervous. I'll take a 727 or bigger any day because they are so expensive they typically have a pilot, copilot, sometimes a flight engineer and typically 3 or more flight attendants. The pilots are IFR, have back up and typically better instrumentation.

727? They are true dinosaurs now.   But they flew a ton of miles. When they first came on the scene, Eastern Air Lines flew them and called them Whisperjets.  It was nice unless you were sitting in the back of the bus in the smoking section. But their first class section was top shelf and took me to boot camp. But I should have refused the "spiked cokes" though. ;D Times have surely changed.

 

[Jayflight]

Well I broke down and ordered my new EV luxury vehicle this week. You guys got to me and educated me and got me up to speed for the 21st century. Thanks

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