My wife and I just sold our travel trailer and are interested in buying a used class A. We have two young children (2 and 6) so luxury is not the top priority. We will do a fair amount of dry camping in the Sothern California desert during motorcycle season (Winter). We are looking for a recomendation as to what are the best brands to consider and whether we should go for the Ford or Chevy version. We think we want 30-35 ft with one slide and are looking to spend less than $50,000. Any advice or recomendations are welcome. Also I have the option of paying cash or financing a portion. I have heard people say it makes much more sense to finance if you can write the interest off as a second home. Can someone explain this.
Looking for recomendation for Class A used
- Thread starter tikka
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Hi Tikka,
We have a 2004 National Dolphin on a Workhorse Chassis. Bought it 2 years used with 10,000 miles on it. It has been a super unit to date. We did a ton of research and it came down to a choice of 3 ... Tiffin, National and Triple E (we live in Canada and Triple E is built here). We would have bought any of the 3, the Dolphin just appeared first.
I'd suggest reading and reading the posts from owners who 1) do and don't have problems and 2) if and how manufacturers stand behind their product when they do. Although you'll find some unhappy owners with any manufacturer, when you read the reviews, it's clear that there are many more complaints with some than others (Fleetwood, Monaco, Winnibego etc seem to come to mind as having more unhappy owners!). But take the time to do your research. Your price point is more likely going to determine the age (at that price you should look at older units that have been gently used and babied) or maybe you should consider a Class C (less room and less sexy, but for $50,000 you may find more choices). The other consideration is gas vs diesel. Our is a 8.1 l gas ... lots of power for the 35ft and 11 tons plus flat towing a Ford Focus. There are lots of people who will tell you that diesel is better. We think it is stinky, noisy, overpriced (new anyway) and diesel fuel costs have increased too. Ours is paired with an Allison 5 speed transmission (newer units have a 6 speed), which is excellent; shifts just when it should, and gives good mileage for a house on wheels.
A word to the wise. All Class A's look pretty, make sure you don't just buy a good floor plan. Buy from a good manufacture (i.e. one that has satisfied owners). Most RV's have quirks ... if you buy privately, ask the owner what little things go wrong. Most also have had leaks (roof, toilet, doors, fresh water etc), again look beyond the beautiful layouts and colours!
Good luck with your search. It's at least half the fun!
We have a 2004 National Dolphin on a Workhorse Chassis. Bought it 2 years used with 10,000 miles on it. It has been a super unit to date. We did a ton of research and it came down to a choice of 3 ... Tiffin, National and Triple E (we live in Canada and Triple E is built here). We would have bought any of the 3, the Dolphin just appeared first.
I'd suggest reading and reading the posts from owners who 1) do and don't have problems and 2) if and how manufacturers stand behind their product when they do. Although you'll find some unhappy owners with any manufacturer, when you read the reviews, it's clear that there are many more complaints with some than others (Fleetwood, Monaco, Winnibego etc seem to come to mind as having more unhappy owners!). But take the time to do your research. Your price point is more likely going to determine the age (at that price you should look at older units that have been gently used and babied) or maybe you should consider a Class C (less room and less sexy, but for $50,000 you may find more choices). The other consideration is gas vs diesel. Our is a 8.1 l gas ... lots of power for the 35ft and 11 tons plus flat towing a Ford Focus. There are lots of people who will tell you that diesel is better. We think it is stinky, noisy, overpriced (new anyway) and diesel fuel costs have increased too. Ours is paired with an Allison 5 speed transmission (newer units have a 6 speed), which is excellent; shifts just when it should, and gives good mileage for a house on wheels.
A word to the wise. All Class A's look pretty, make sure you don't just buy a good floor plan. Buy from a good manufacture (i.e. one that has satisfied owners). Most RV's have quirks ... if you buy privately, ask the owner what little things go wrong. Most also have had leaks (roof, toilet, doors, fresh water etc), again look beyond the beautiful layouts and colours!
Good luck with your search. It's at least half the fun!
Interest on an RV home is USUALLY tax deductible as mortgage interest on a "vacation home" so long as it meets certain requirements including that it have sleeping, bathroom, and cooking facilities (there's more but this is the basic requirement). Whether or not it is to your benefit to have that mortgage deduction, depends on your personal tax situation. We don't have a lot of taxable income so for us it makes no nevermind. Try taking your last year's tax return, adjust your Schedule A to include your estimated RV mortgage interest, and see if it's going to save you anything on your taxes....it should at least save you the cost of the interest. Of course, this doesn't take into account what you could have made investing the money (and paying mortgage interest) versus paying cash for the RV and saving the mortgage interest.
Hope this makes sense.....probably doesn't as it's related to the US Income Tax system
Wendy
Hope this makes sense.....probably doesn't as it's related to the US Income Tax system
Wendy
If you take out a loan it is better to be able to have the interest as a tax deduction that not, of course.
But I have a hard time seeing how you can save money by taking out a tax-deductible loan versus paying cash. If you have a 10-year 7.5% RV loan for $50,000, you pay $3,631 in interest the first year. If you are in a 30% tax bracket and claim that interest as deductible, then you may save $1089 but you've still paid out $2,542 in net interest after the tax deduction. Compare that to $0 in interest if you were able to pay the cash up-front.
If you had the cash, but took out the loan anyway and invested your cash, you would have to make 7.5% on your investment to come out even, after taxes and deductions. Subsequent years would be more favorable as you pay down the principal, but IMO you are better off to pay the cash if you are able.
But I have a hard time seeing how you can save money by taking out a tax-deductible loan versus paying cash. If you have a 10-year 7.5% RV loan for $50,000, you pay $3,631 in interest the first year. If you are in a 30% tax bracket and claim that interest as deductible, then you may save $1089 but you've still paid out $2,542 in net interest after the tax deduction. Compare that to $0 in interest if you were able to pay the cash up-front.
If you had the cash, but took out the loan anyway and invested your cash, you would have to make 7.5% on your investment to come out even, after taxes and deductions. Subsequent years would be more favorable as you pay down the principal, but IMO you are better off to pay the cash if you are able.
Have you looked at a Tiffin Product? Bob Tiffin and his company is the best extended warrant in the business. Almost every mfg uses the same components. It's how they use them and if they stand behind their product. Talk to a Red Bay service veteran.
JMHO
JMHO
Tom
Administrator
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PJMac said:
There are a lot of happy owners of those brands who would disagree with that statement. I've talked to many Monaco owners and haven't found any that are unhappy with their coaches. Most buy (or will buy) Monaco again when it's time to upgrade/replace. Monaco does a really good job of supporting their customers, including those who purchased Holiday Rambler, Beaver and Safari products before those companies were acquired by Monaco. A number of folks here have reported very positive experience with Monaco's factory service centers and I've personally had very positive experiences with two of those. Monaco also sends dozens of techs to various rallies to support their customers.
Dealer experience is a much different issue. Personally, I had terrible dealer support for my Monaco, which is why I now only deal with Monaco factory service centers. Not all dealer service experience is as bad as mine, but there are numerous reports here of poor dealer service.
We previously owned a Pace Arrow (made by Fleetwood) and were happy campers.
This not meant to detract from the positive comments about other manufacturers.
Thanks everyone for the information. It does help with the decision making. I have seen some deals that looked to good to be true and like in all things they probably were. So we're going to take it slow and do a lot of rersearch before we buy. Thanks for the explanation on finacial end of the spectrum I think I tend to lean to the pay for it if you can scholl my dad always said "it's best not to owe anyone, anything".
Ron
Moderator Emeritus
PJMac said:
Like Tom I am sure there are many that would disagree with your statement. Having owned two Bounders an now the American Eagle we have been happy with all of them. Monaco owners seem very happy campers too. You might take into consideration that the companies you mentioned have the highest number of sales and therefore more exposure. However, there is a reason they have higher number of sales which they wouldn't have if their product wasn't any good.
I worked for Winnebago for 15 years, two of them in owner relations and although there were unhappy customers, I believe that alot of the frustration was getting it fixed right the first...or fifth time! One reason you may hear more about issues with the 3 you mentioned is they sell more coaches individually than most of the other combined! At one time Fleetwood was #1 with more Bounder sales than any other RV manufacturer and now Winnebago is #1. Every RV manufacturer goes thru a rough spot some time in their history, and every one has a few "issue" coaches as well. And one thing you will find...EVERY coach will need service at some time I don't care who it is. There are over 3,000 components in an RV. Then you engineer a coach that uses fiberglass, aluminum, steel, wood, plastic, rubber, composite materials and manufacture a coach that sits on a dealer lot for months with temps at 20 degrees or less in the morning and 60+ in the afternoon. All those materials expand and contract differently and it's an engineering challenge/nightmare. Then we take that unit and run down the road 70+ mph, shove out the sides with slides, and wonder why we have to take it to the dealer. If you ever build a house, eventually you have to caulk the windows, replace some siding, reshingle, and patch drywall when it settles. And just like houses, some build them better than others. Which brings me to what I feel is the best advice when shopping for an RV...shop like you would when you look at a house. Look at the materials used in manufactureing, alot of mgf's use particle board and veneer, not a bad thing, just not upscale and sometimes not as durable. Here are some tips:
You have 2 children...where are they going to sleep? One bedroom means you have to fold down the couch or dinette, or both every night, this makes the living room useless after they go to bed. And it's not very comfortable. Maybe look at a class c, or a unit with side bunks?
What are you going to tow and carry? Find the posts about GVWR, CCC, GCWR etc. Some coaches have alot of carry capacity, some don't.
Dry camping??? Generator? Solar power? Inverter? Water/Sewage capacity?
Some things to look for in a used coach to avoid trouble:
Stains on the ceiling around AC, inside front cabinets, etc. look for roof leaks
Weight distribution...get it weighed and find the GVWR and GAWR, something too heavy in the front won't drive well and stop well.
Maintenance records.
Good Sam and I believe Camping World have a Certification Program that covers over 100 points that also may be a good idea to look at? Unless you are buying from a good dealer.
You have 2 children...where are they going to sleep? One bedroom means you have to fold down the couch or dinette, or both every night, this makes the living room useless after they go to bed. And it's not very comfortable. Maybe look at a class c, or a unit with side bunks?
What are you going to tow and carry? Find the posts about GVWR, CCC, GCWR etc. Some coaches have alot of carry capacity, some don't.
Dry camping??? Generator? Solar power? Inverter? Water/Sewage capacity?
Some things to look for in a used coach to avoid trouble:
Stains on the ceiling around AC, inside front cabinets, etc. look for roof leaks
Weight distribution...get it weighed and find the GVWR and GAWR, something too heavy in the front won't drive well and stop well.
Maintenance records.
Good Sam and I believe Camping World have a Certification Program that covers over 100 points that also may be a good idea to look at? Unless you are buying from a good dealer.
scottydl
Site Team
tikka said:
Amen, brother. It's always cheapest to pay cash. Don't get sucked into the debt vortex if you can avoid it!
tikka said:
This is the absolute best thing you can do. I researched online (pretty heavily, as in several hours a week) for a solid year before we bought our '94 Thor. It was the exact make/model I had decided on, at a price that couldn't be beat. Doesn't mean it hasn't had a few "issues" along the way, but that will be the case with anything you buy. I'd imagine with a $50k budget you are looking at models that are much newer, so you probably won't have to search QUITE as hard. But this forum is a wealth of information (although many folks' input are opinions, so take that into account) and there are many true RV experts here. But you will learn the most by doing your own research, in finding exactly what will work for your family and individual situation. Good luck!
