NEW N. AMERICA PASSPORTS REQUIRED

[fredethomas]

It was announced today [4/5] that all USA citizens will need passports to return to USA from Mexico, Canada and S. America.

What a mess.  Think of the thousands of North Americans [USA and Canada] that cross back and forth in places like Yuma and other Snowbird areas.  Then there are thoses that cross Canada to enter Alaska.

Glad I did not vote for him.

 

[Tom]

Glad I did not vote for him.

You didn't vote for El President Fox? Shame on you.

 

[Ned]

That isn't to take effect until 2008. ?The article is available at http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/04/05/passports050405.html, a Canadian news outlet.

Lots of time to get a passport.

 

[Ron]

Citizens and legal visiters only will require passports but the illegals will not.  just don't seem right to me.

 

[Terry A. Brewer]

Fred

>>It was announced today [4/5] that all USA citizens will need passports to return to USA from Mexico, Canada and S. America.<<

it's about time.<G>

How's your Minute Man duty coming along in Sierra Vista?


Terry
At Yuma, AZ

 

[blueblood]

It was announced today [4/5] that all USA citizens will need passports to return to USA from Mexico, Canada and S. America.

What a mess.  Think of the thousands of North Americans [USA and Canada] that cross back and forth in places like Yuma and other Snowbird areas.  Then there are thoses that cross Canada to enter Alaska.

Glad I did not vote for him.

It's a minor problem like getting a drivers license. Many folks have them anyway since they travel elsewhere and need them. I don't think it makes any difference who is President this is going to be derigour for all kinds of things. I just moved back to SC for 4th time in 35 years. This time I had to provide proof of residency, proof of identity and proof of citizenship to get my drivers license. These were introduced in wake of 911 with a minimal number of acceptable forms of proof.  I had trouble supplying two of them. Proof of residency because as a renter I had no home closing statement to show. They would take a utility bill but I hadn't yet had one since I just moved in and in addition both my wife and I had to appear on the bill and we had not set up any accounts with both (never have) not knowing this was going to be a problem. They would accept a bank statement and luckily I had changed the address on line and the bank statement timing was that week so I had it and both our names were on it.  Proof of citizenship required social secuity card but my 60 year old card was not acceptable since they ruled it was the stub from the card not the card per se. This form of card had never been challanged by any one including federal government for high level security clearances ,etc. They did take my passport as an alternative. I am reappying for a SSA new card this week since I think as I said one had better be prepared across the board for this type of increased scrutiny whether we like it or not and I am taking proactive steps to clean up our records. For example, my birth certificate does not say Jr while my SSA card does. They challanged me on this discrepancy as well. I have to work this out somehow with SSA because I'm sure the State of Ohio isn't going to be willing to change my BC 70+ years later (although I may have to pursue that alternative). The problem is compounded by the fact I was told to drop the Jr when my dad died but due to his being published in technical journals it was decide that it couldn't be done for legal reasons related to publishing rights. It never mattered to now and I was very happy remaining Jr.

 

[Ron]

The biggest problem I have with this is with all these thing being put in place in interest of security thay are doing nothing about the real security threat.  The southern boarder and all the illegal crossing that go on there every day.  If a terrorest wanted in all they would have to do is come across with a group of Mexicans say near Douglas sign up for welfare and they would have full access to the country with more rights then our citizens.    In interest of security they need to stop the illegal crossings on the Southern boarder even if it means getting rough. Just my opinion.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

I've got to agree, Ron. A long as the southern border leaks like sieve, all these other actions are a joke.

 

[blueblood]

I've got to agree, Ron. A long as the southern border leaks like sieve, all these other actions are a joke.

I agree also. It's a tough issue because of both internal and geo politics. The internal politics was neatly played out last night on the Bill O'Reilly show. I don't normally watch this show but I was channel surfing as I installed a new TV and saw Bill arguing with his guest Juan Williams the liberal columnist. Bill was taking the hard right position that like the Chinese have done in very effectively sealing off the border with N Korea, we should do the same. Juan was mocking Bill for wanting to be like the Chinese and then threw in that one can't stop the human desire to come to a country like the US, so if we seal the borders then they'll come by air or boat. He didn't say it but his conclusion  was clearly "so let's do nothing". and that's where we find ourselves. If Bush takes the hard right position he'll be critised by liberals, the media, the Mexican legal and illegals in this country, the UN Human Rights Commission and foreign governments, etc. He apparently doesn't have the will to do it so we're left with doing nothing much. 

We can't even deport over 700,000 Mexican illegals who have been convicted in this country of a crime. The advocacy groups raise one roadblock after another in our liberal courts and win.   

 

[Jim Johnson]

I've got to agree, Ron. A long as the southern border leaks like sieve, all these other actions are a joke.

on the Bill O'Reilly show. 
   

Well, it has taken some time, but you have finally gone to the right source for your news.  (G) I can hardly wait to get to Moab to be able to talk to you about your new-found insight.  Welcome aboard!!!

 

[blueblood]

I've got to agree, Ron. A long as the southern border leaks like sieve, all these other actions are a joke.

on the Bill O'Reilly show. 
   

Well, it has taken some time, but you have finally gone to the right source for your news.  (G) I can hardly wait to get to Moab to be able to talk to you about your new-found insight.  Welcome aboard!!!

Two errors there. A) I'm not coming to Moab - just left UT to move to SC and not going to retrace my steps. Had enough driving for a few days.  ;D B) Not a new insight or information. My son managed a border post in TX for awhile and presently is in Homeland Security and we talk extensively on the issues and complexities toward any solution/s quite regularly. 

 

[BernieD]

That isn't to take effect until 2008.  The article is available at http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/04/05/passports050405.html, a Canadian news outlet.

Lots of time to get a passport.

True, but if you fly or sail it is sooner. Also, $97 each for the passports.

 

[BernieD]

Citizens and legal visiters only will require passports but the illegals will not.  just don't seem right to me.

OK, let's pass a law to make illegals carry passports ;D ;D ;D

 

[BernieD]

The biggest problem I have with this is with all these thing being put in place in interest of security thay are doing nothing about the real security threat.  The southern boarder and all the illegal crossing that go on there every day.  If a terrorest wanted in all they would have to do is come across with a group of Mexicans say near Douglas sign up for welfare and they would have full access to the country with more rights then our citizens.    In interest of security they need to stop the illegal crossings on the Southern boarder even if it means getting rough. Just my opinion.

Ron

Need to clarify a few points. First, the miltary has been working on detection systems that can monitor wide areas. They are being tested in the area around Douglas, AZ.

Next, in the last election a referendum was passed requiring adequate proof of citizenship before receiving public benefits in AZ. Public employees can be fined for failure to follow the law.

I don't understand how illegals have more rights than citizens ??? ???

 

[Ron]

Bernie,

In the first place the Southern boarder should have been made secure 40 years ago.  Second that is hogwash about testing detection systems since they already have them anlong areas of Canadian Boarder. 

The last law may have changed things in Az but not in all States. If they can't get something here they just to where they can.

We citizens that Mexican, Canadian, or ourselves that have not crossed the boarders illegally will be required to carry passports to cross now but those crossing over illegally will continue as they have in the past.

I have nothing aganst the Mexican people that are hear legally but I am against letting anybody that enters our country illegally remain here.

 

[blueblood]

Fred

>>It was announced today [4/5] that all USA citizens will need passports to return to USA from Mexico, Canada and S. America.<<



Terry
At Yuma, AZ

Some added information


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/TPStory/LAC/20050407/PASS07/TPNational/Canada

 

[Phil]

It was announced today [4/5] that all USA citizens will need passports to return to USA from Mexico, Canada and S. America.

Fred,

Passport or other aceptable id.  Some states are so lax with drivers license requirements that it's easy for an undocumented person to get a DL.  The states were given a time frame to fix the drivers license problem OR ELSE residents of those states would not be able to use the DL as valid id to enter this country.

Utah was one of the bad states.  The 2005 legislature FIXED the problem with a change to the drivers license requirements.

Now, undocumented persons living in Utah can get a driving privilge card but will not be able to get a "real" drivers license.  The "real" Utah drivers license will get you back into the USA when the new requirement takes effect.

No passport required with a "real" drivers license.

Phil

 

[quasi]

A crackdown on illegal entry from Mexico recently produced some interesting results. The INS was attacked and eventually was forced to ease up on enforcement, allowing aliens to cross over. The primary motivating participant in this affair was the agricultural lobby. There weren't enough Mexicans to harvest the lettuce crop and the US agribusiness interests went ballistic.

I agree that there should be better border control, but sealing the border doesn't work. Allowing lawful entry for employment with the appropriate documentation seems smarter to me. After all, the person who is going to commit a felony won't be deterred because there's a city ordinance. The laws we have now and the enforcement strategies don't seem to fit the times we live in.

Jim
(putting away soapbox)

 

[Ron]

I have no problem with folks coming in to work if they have entered leagaly.  However, anybody sneaking across the boarder is a lawbreaker and should not be allowd to work or stay in this country.  Furthermore  anybody found hireing iileagals should be fined heavely in addition to paying any costs incurred by the illeagal and cost to return them back accross the boarder.

 

[Jeff]

I agree that there should be better border control, but sealing the border doesn't work. Allowing lawful entry for employment with the appropriate documentation seems smarter to me. After all, the person who is going to commit a felony won't be deterred because there's a city ordinance. The laws we have now and the enforcement strategies don't seem to fit the times we live in.

I have maintained for years that the illegals keep coming because of the jobs. They would not move here to starve.

If we really want this to stop put every US employer, owner, manager, farmer, and housewife in jail for 1 year who hires an illegal alien. Require them to register their employees who are not US citizens with INS instead of simply requiring employees to fill out a Form 9 with fake ID and put it in a filing cabinet.

We lived in Illinois for 35 years and every time they did a roundup it was employers like Green Giant who lost their cheap labor. If any fine was levied it still made monetary sense to hire illegal aliens at low wages.