Replacing a leaking water heater

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andonso

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I have a motorhome with an Atwood G6A-7E water heater that developed a pin hole leak on the side of the tank.

I found a new replacement 6 gallon tank for $143.80. (Atwood p/n 91641)

The motorhome is lived in year around connected to PUD and gas isn't really ever used as the appliances have been replaced with electric.

I'm trying to look at options to replace the 6 gallon tank with a larger one such as 10 to 25 gallons or what ever would fit as the space for the current water heater can be expanded  to 39 in. (long) x 24 in. (wide) x 14 in. (high).

The Atwood  G6A-7E was at one time connected to gas but gas wasn't used much. I'm not certain if the G6G-7E was originally electric or if someone one added an aftermarket electrode as it has a metal 400 watt rod connected to a thermostat on the side of the tank that plugs into an AC 110 outlet. Another limitation is the RV only has 110 30 amp service so it's not able to use a water heater that requires 220/240 VAC. Which eliminates high wattage tankless water heaters as a choice.

I've come across a few deals for RV 10 gal. water heaters but would prefer to have at least ~15 gallons of hot water.

I'm uncertain of my options and how much more I would need to spend to have ~15+ gallons of hot water and will a water heater with a larger tank fit into the space, installed horizontally? 

Most electric water heaters basically are a tank with an electrode and thermostat.


 
How old is the heater?  If it's not old, I'd get it welded.

We have a 10 gallon water heater and we never run out of hot water. Then again, we don't take a half hour showers while the water continuously runs. If that's going to be an issue with you, you can run electric and gas the same time to make the recovery much quicker.
 
I currently  don't have any gas connected to the RV which for myself is good when traveling or boon docking.

I've replaced the little  RV Magic Chef oven with a convection / microwave oven, I looked around for a replacement rv gas oven but considering their size and quality I decided to get an electric convection oven with microwave that has an heavy oven door.

next I'm going to install a stove top with electric burners where the rv oven was installed, freeing up space for storage.

I'm also replacing a 12+ year old 6.7 cu ft Norcold with a 10.7 cu. ft Whirlpool that frost free. One reason is during heavy rain, rain storms the Norcold quits, after up to several days of drying out it starts to work again.

My RV furnance quit working so I decided to use electric heaters and sometimes a Mr Heater (during freezing weather). RV furnaces put out great heat however their not very efficient 30+ percent of the heat is vented to prevent condensation, also they require 12 volts to run a fan which is for safely reasons when the furnace starts and stops. Not so good when boon docking, trying to maintain batteries. But they do put out great heat and keep an RV at proper temperatures. If have the time  going to try and repair it as for myself it's nice to use once in a while in cold weather.

This motorhome stays connected to PUD 24/7. I don't really take long showers in fact the only method to shower is to first lather, scrub and then carefully rinse not using too much hot water. Haven't  timed my showers but assume are 5 mins or less, hot water is normally depleted after taking  ~5 min  showers.

Washing dishes, if there's alot of dishes I usually need to split washing into two or three parts,  after each wash need to provide the water heater enough time to recover.

I think the problem may be the 400 watt heating element or perhaps I need to set the thermostat a higher setting?

If I purchase the Atwood 6 gal. replacement tank I may need to also purchase a higher wattage element? The one installed is a a metal rod with the actual element inside the rod.

It's connect AC outlet ==== thermostat on side of tank ===== heating rod installed in tank's drain port.

So perhaps I can upgrade the rod to a higher wattage heating element that will fit the drain port?


 
The Atwood G6A-7E is a gas only water heater.  The electric element you have in the tank is an after-market add-on called a Hot Rod.

The problem is the limited amount of power available from a 30 amp, 120 volt outlet ... 3600 watts.  A factory installed electric heating element uses about half that power, or 1500 watts.  Even at that, it produces less than half as much heat as the propane flame.  It will take a 1500 watt element close to an hour to heat a cold 6 gallon tank of water.  A 400 watt element is even worse, it's meant more to maintain an already hot tank hot, not heat cold water to hot.

Put in a larger tank and it will take even longer to heat the water.  That's why larger water heaters use 240 volts where more energy is available so they can put more heat energy into the tank.
 
Boy, if I knew I had to replace a tank I would definitely think it was time for me to look into an on-demand system.
 
breezie said:
Boy, if I knew I had to replace a tank I would definitely think it was time for me to look into an on-demand system.
Click to expand...

I had one and couldn't wait to get rid of it.  The Atwood on-demand water heater that directly replaces an RV tank type heater really sucks.
 
Lou Schneider said:
The Atwood G6A-7E is a gas only water heater.  The electric element you have in the tank is an after-market add-on called a Hot Rod.

The problem is the limited amount of power available from a 30 amp, 120 volt outlet ... 3600 watts.  A factory installed electric heating element uses about half that power, or 1500 watts.  Even at that, it produces less than half as much heat as the propane flame.  It will take a 1500 watt element close to an hour to heat a cold 6 gallon tank of water.  A 400 watt element is even worse, it's meant more to maintain an already hot tank hot, not heat cold water to hot.

Put in a larger tank and it will take even longer to heat the water.  That's why larger water heaters use 240 volts where more energy is available so they can put more heat energy into the tank.
Click to expand...

One problem with installing a 240 volt water heater is most RV parks only have 110/120 30 amp service. However a dual voltage water heater might be sensible solution.

Since my RV stays in one spot connected to a 110/130 30 amp service. I'm of either installing a new 6 gallon tank and upgrade the heating element or perhaps get a deal on a new gas electric with 6 or 10 gallon tank.

I've found various deal on "new" RV water heaters on eBay some are store returns because the orig purchaser orded the wrong water heater while other are "new" scratch and dents. Most are missing parts such as for gas or water heater control.

E,g, here's a Suburban SW10DE for $199.99 plus $40.00 shipping https://www.ebay.com/itm/Suburban-SW10DE-RV-Water-Heater-10-Gallon-DSI-Trailer-Camper-Free-Shipping/253973245568?epid=7004682712&hash=item3b21fc2e80:g:rkQAAOSws2Rb5fIg:rk:7:pf:0

People have picked this water heater and similar up at auction new or barely used for as little as $70.00.

The one on Ebay cost would be $240.00 that's gas and electric, however I don't see any heating element so that might need to be purchased separately.

Another option I've been thinking about is a 7 Gal. Electric Point-of-Use Water Heater $203.30 with free pickup or delivery.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Bosch-7-Gal-Electric-Point-of-Use-Water-Heater-ES-8/206428468?cm_sp=BazVoice-_-QA_PQRDR-_-206428468-_-x

From questions and answeres one person asked if can be used in a motorhome? Answers were yes and yes. This is a common application.

Requires 110 and 12 amps. The tank has a limited warranty of 6 years.

I think it would provide enough hot water for one person washing dishes and taking a shower every once in a while, as the recovery time I'm told is only around 30 mins, however I'm not certain how the this type of water heater would last compared to a RV water heaters that potentially last 30+ years.

 
Look at the Atwood XT series of heaters. The 6 gallon size provides an effective 10 gallons of hot water. It does this by operating the heater at a higher temp than standard RV heaters and then blending cold water at the tank outlet.  Or you can get the model that is 10 gallons actual and 16 gallon effective.

Any new electric heater will give you at least a little more hot water than your old electric conversion, simply because it has a 1400 watt (12 amps) heater vs the 300-400 watts you likely have in the conversion. The drawback is the one Lou cited - it uses more of your limited electric power supply.
 
andonso said:
I have a motorhome with an Atwood G6A-7E water heater that developed a pin hole leak on the side of the tank.

I found a new replacement 6 gallon tank for $143.80. (Atwood p/n 91641)

The motorhome is lived in year around connected to PUD and gas isn't really ever used as the appliances have been replaced with electric.

I'm trying to look at options to replace the 6 gallon tank with a larger one such as 10 to 25 gallons or what ever would fit as the space for the current water heater can be expanded  to 39 in. (long) x 24 in. (wide) x 14 in. (high).

The Atwood  G6A-7E was at one time connected to gas but gas wasn't used much. I'm not certain if the G6G-7E was originally electric or if someone one added an aftermarket electrode as it has a metal 400 watt rod connected to a thermostat on the side of the tank that plugs into an AC 110 outlet. Another limitation is the RV only has 110 30 amp service so it's not able to use a water heater that requires 220/240 VAC. Which eliminates high wattage tankless water heaters as a choice.

I've come across a few deals for RV 10 gal. water heaters but would prefer to have at least ~15 gallons of hot water.

I'm uncertain of my options and how much more I would need to spend to have ~15+ gallons of hot water and will a water heater with a larger tank fit into the space, installed horizontally? 

Most electric water heaters basically are a tank with an electrode and thermostat.
Click to expand...
andonso
Since you don't have enough vertical room can you modify your coach to make room for this 19 gallon 120VAC water heater?
https://www.acehardware.com/departments/plumbing/water-heaters/electric-water-heaters/40158?x429=true&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&gclid=CjwKCAiAiarfBRASEiwAw1tYv3hEww8I05ATKn6_upNUOSHg2rdBn7zAakmBe-WRnWao1Wl2mD3kRxoC8isQAvD_BwE
 
I guess I could make some modifications to the existing water heater location.

There's a piece of plywood that covers the water heater and storage compartment, approx. 14" high x 24" wide x 19" deep.

So I could remove the plywood cover, creating a space approx. ~24" wide x ~19" deep. and then build some sort of water heater  box shaped cover out of plywood.

_____________

I did find a new Atwood aluminum  replacement tank for ~$150.00 and could replace the 400 watt heating element with a 1400 or 1500 watt screw in type, using the existing thermostat.

The existing Atwood 6 gallon water heater with alum. tank was used mostly on a daily basis for around 28 years until the tank developed a pin hole leak.

However having 20 gallons may be worth the additional expense. Though I'm uncertain if the 20 gallon water heater is built to last ~25 to ~30 years?

I found another 20 gallon water heater from home depot that should also fit, however there is no drain port. From what I've read you can drain it by installing a T-fitting with spigot on the lower cold water inlet.

It's manufactured by Rheem I'm not certain how the quality compares to a Reliance, both come with a 6 year manufacture warranty.

Reliance is a subsidiary of A.O. Smith.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Rheem-Performance-20-Gal-6-Year-2000-Watt-Single-Element-Electric-Point-Of-Use-Water-Heater-XE20P06PU20U0/204318374

I found another one that's 28 gallons and approx. an inch and a half taller however  requires a 240 vac service.

Reliance Water Heater 6 30 Eols Low Boy Water Heater, Electric, 28-Gals

I've found online for as little as $323.00 with free shipping.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/A-O-Smith-Signature-28-Gallon-Lowboy-6-year-Limited-4500-Watt-Double-Element-Electric-Water-Heater/1000213691

So I don't think I'm going to be able to find any water heaters close to 30 gallons that use 110 VAC, as most have higher watt heating elements, some use two heating element instead of one. such as 2 x 4500 watt heating elements.







 
 
I think if i decide not to get the 6 gal alum. replacement tank for the Atwood RV water heater.  I'm going to purchase the one from Home Depot which I'm told can be run from a 20 amp breaker in the RV.

I will probably eventually wire it in to it's own 25 amp breaker using 10 gauge wire.

it uses a 2000 watt element

2000 watts at 120 volts = 2000/120 = 16.66 amps however the manufacture I'm told recommends a 25 amp breaker where elect. codes requires #10 wire

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Rheem-Performance-20-Gal-6-Year-2000-Watt-Single-Element-Electric-Point-Of-Use-Water-Heater-XE20P06PU20U0/204318374

Also would probably need to find

A drain pan. The one that fits this water heater at home depot is 20 inch internal x 21 inches external can be crammed into a 20 inch depth space without modifications.

Water lines 15 to 24 inches to connect to the motorhome pex tubing.

T-valve  with spigot to connect to the water inlet for draining the tank.

20 gallons isn't all that much hot water and the recovery time I'm told is from around ~one to ~two hours depending on the temperature of the water supply and the amount of insulation surrounding the water heater.


 
When my hot water tank sprang a leak, it was going to be a nighmare of remodeling to replace the tank.

Being an old salt, it came to mind to use underwater weld.

Amazon dispatched $5 worth of  J-B Waterweld

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BRQ0TW/

I followed the instructions exactly.

That fixed the leaky hot water.

3 years later when I sold the RV, it was still leak free!

By the way, turn your thermostat to maximum on the hot water tank and it lasts a lot longer.
 
DearMissMermaid said:
When my hot water tank sprang a leak, it was going to be a nighmare of remodeling to replace the tank.

By the way, turn your thermostat to maximum on the hot water tank and it lasts a lot longer.
Click to expand...

Where is the adjustable thermostat?  I didn't think they were adjustable.
 
Two thoughts:

a. A six or ten gallon water heater is entirely reasonable or 99% of us would not put up with them.

b. The 20 gal heater weighs over 150 lb. Thats a lot to support with just the pipes.

Ernie
 
If one can find the space, is it cost effective (or even possible) to add an AquaHot system that uses diesel?
 
breezie said:
If one can find the space, is it cost effective (or even possible) to add an AquaHot system that uses diesel?
Click to expand...

I don't know whether it's possible (maybe), but I'm reasonably sure it's not cost effective, since the typical installation pervades the coach, providing a water heater and furnace, both heated from a separate boiler arrangement (with its own fluid, typically water with antifreeze, non-potable, with heat exchanger) which not only has a diesel fired boiler, but also uses engine heat to keep it hot while on the road. Some units even include a block heater.

Still, there are folks who know a lot more about this, so maybe they know things about this that I don't (quite likely, now that I think about it).
 
Generally the only thing that will fit in a six gallon hole is a six gallon tank.

Now Atwood does something others don't they make a 10 gallon water heater with a 6 gallon tank
How do they do that?
Standard heater is pre-set to 120 degrees. but if you heat it to say 160 or 190 (I am not sure which they use) then mix in some cold water through a thermostatic valve (More to go wrong) you get 10 gallons at 120 degrees.  You also use more energy as the hotter the tank the more it needs re-heating due to heat loss.

The other option is an 80 gallon (in my case) Heater. this is a "Tankless" most of them will fit in a 6 gallon hole.. THey do not store hot water but "FLSAH" heat it using propane as you draw.

THe advantage here is they will heat till your run out of water (My fresh tank is 80 gallons) or till you run out of Propane (I hold about 27 gallons) you basically never run out.

THe disadvantage is at low flow.. they do not work.  As Well read up on the SAIL SWITCH on an RV Furnace. the Tankless uses a FLOW SWITCH. Same concept only water instead of wind.

They also use NO energy when you are not drawing water so ultimately they are very efficient.


Finally a suggestion: When I put the new tank on my Atwood I swapped the 1500 Watt 120 volt element for a 1500 at 240 volt (making a 375 watt at 120 volt) takes longer to heat but so far I've only needed to hit the gas once (Today in fact) in the year plus I've had it. 

WHy drop the wattage???? Well I used to trip 30 amp breakers when on a 30 amp site. No so much today.


FInally a handy at times Temporary solution
Coleman used to market a portable Tankless Water Heater.. It came with a 5 Gallon water bottle and a battery charger (It has an internal battery) Runs off the disposable propane bottles.

I had one 15 years ago used it when I needed hot water OUTSIDE like for some landscapers who got a bit messy and really enjoyed a warm shower and for some Construction and cleanup crews when we did the Rebuliding ... Also can be used for showers and such.

Limit indoor use and make sure you have proper ventalation (Same with any propane device) but sine it only burns gas when in use... Generally safe for short term same as stove top.  Wish I still had it in fact.
 
TLRam1 said:
Will the RV system allow both to work (gas & Elec) at the same time?
Click to expand...
On water heaters, yes but, to the best of my knowledge not on the fridge -- it's not an RV limitation but is a fridge limitation.
 
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