Am I too picky?? (Took Delivery of New RV)

[lmichel]

Yesterday I drove to the dealership and took delivery of my brand new 2016 Thor Outlaw (37RB). 
My current Newmar Kountry Star was 12 years old and left me stranded at the side of the road once too many times.  So I traded it in.
I negotiated hard, as the 2017s are already appearing on dealer lots.  I figured I'd get a good deal.

When I arrived, they explained that the rear automatic awning was not working and they were struggling to figure it out.  They didn't have a replacement and Thor was closed for the holiday already.  They offered to let me take it, and next week they would even come and get it, fix it, fill the tank and bring it back.  The dealer is 75 miles from me.  I went to a bit of trouble to get someone to take the time to drive me over there so I took them up on it.

On the drive home I noticed that the steering wheel is not aligned.  In fact, going straight, the wheel points to about 10 o'clock.
Later I noticed that the magic fan in the kitchen ceiling had a blown inline fuse and it blows again as soon as replaced.
The rear garage is supposed to have a stainless tool cabinet.  (if you know these RVs)  I checked the standard features list and verified I should have one.  There isn't one.  Nor are there any signs that one was ever installed - no holes, etc.
I happened to check on the coach batteries.  I wanted to coat the terminals with corrosion spray.  Huh, one of the batteries has a cap missing!
The good news is that the terminals were already coated.
I tried the rear ramp door.  There's no spring help for the first 1/2 of lowering it.  The spring tension was set so loose that the cables came unwound and tangled from all the slack.

Obviously, I will have them fix all this stuff or compensate me for fixing it.
How upset would you be?? 
I don't have much experience with dealers - I usually buy used and from a private seller.
But we're talking about more than $100k being spent.  Shouldn't it be *perfect*??

Lance

 

[JDOnTheGo]

IF I ever bought new (big if), I would expect it to be VERY close to perfect before I drove it off the lot and/or completed the financial side of the transaction.  I know that would mean many trips, many arguments, and many hours of inspection time (on the lot).  The things I would accept are the things I know how to fix and I know are not big deals.

 

[jackiemac]

I am constantly surprised at the poor quality on new products in the US. I always thought there was zero tolerance on poor quality but unfortunately not.

See if you can camp out at the dealer for a few days to ensure everything is working to your satisfaction. That way you can ensure everything resolved without more trips. 

Good luck, and safe travels.

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

That's pathetic!  Even if it came from the factory that way, the dealer should have caught most of it in his prep (obviously not much was done!).

I would hope for perfection and not really expect it, but the issues you found are way to far.

 

[cgmartin]

I know we all do it, and we would all like to drive our new toy home as soon as possible, but would we drive home a new car if it was not perfect? I know I should not compare the quality of cars to motorhomes, but I have never bought a new car and had to go back for a missing part. When paying thousands upon thousands of dollars for a motorhome, why would we drive away with an unfinished product? We should put their feet to the fire (motorhome dealers) and not accept mediocre products.  (Just venting..so take it easy on me!!)

 

[lmichel]

I suspected this was the case.  It's tough to imagine that these dealers get so complacent about taking care of details that I listed.
Well, they committed to fixing everything on my list, regardless of how insignificant.  We'll see..

I'm pretty sure they just wanted to get the sale in before the end of June.  I picked the RV up on June 30th.  That's why they wanted me to take it with the one awning not functional.  I certainly might have refused if I wasn't more than an hours drive from home.  Taking it may have a silver lining in that it gave me much more opportunity to inspect it for other issues. 

Stay tuned

Thanks

- Lance

 

[1PlasticMan1]

Today, after more than a year, my coach is as it should have been the day I took delivery.  I cannot believe the number of trips I have taken to the dealer (two hours each way, and almost 40 gallons of gas) to fix different things, plus one trip to the manufacturer to fix what the dealer could not, and yesterday a trip to a Carefree dealer to fix an awning recently replaced by my dealer who installed the replacement that never worked because the way he did it, the wires to the motor pulled away from the motor while they were testing it.  Also, the Carefree dealer found that three adjustment screws were lying in the bed of the awning.  If you ever need an awning repaired, and are in the Denver area, go to Aerosuds Accessories in Bromfield.  There people are extremely accomodating and knowledgeable.
Quality control seems to be something manufacturers and dealers know nothing about.  I feel after all of my problems that the manufacturer leaves it up to the dealer to correct their mistakes, and the dealer won't really correct them until he can fix them under warranty, instead of make ready for delivery.

 

[Bobski]

Makes me glad I bought used.......

 

[whiteva]

Blessed with retirement I am lucky my friends that own a large dealership wisely asked me to use my knowledge of units from TT to 45' motor homes to educate purchasers (since I work on my own MH and hang around the dealership anyway). Even though I only "work" a couple of days a week I am part of several Quality Control and delivery personnel. 

Let me start by observing what arrives from the factory requires a very through inspection. This dealer has two employees dedicated to ensure the unit is complete and has all items and options based on the build sticker on arrival. 45 min for small units to 2 hours on the big bus. Punch list is started and given to the maint dept. 

After cosmetic repairs the unit is placed on the sales line. All needed repairs are not accomplished because when the customer buys, they are told a few days are needed to thoroughly inspect and complete the checklist for a fresh delivery. (some buyers wish to immediately drive off the lot but that is not a good idea)

Depending on the make and model, specific techs are assigned to the unit for Pre-deliverly inspection. Based upon an extensive checklist the tech must exercise all systems several times and check each operation such all slides, fridge, leveling system,hitch bolts, kingpin, radios, speakers, TVs, ect. Part of the PDI is all safety options must be verified such as LP alarm, fire detectors, carbon monx alarm and certify the LP lines have been pressurized and maintains pressure for 4 hours. Not enough room here to delve into all items including wheel pressure and torque on each lug nut but you get an idea. On complicated units this can eat up multiple days.

Once the check list is completed it is turned over to quality control inspector such as myself for verification. We open every cabinet, drawer vent, slides in and out, awning checked etc.  We then meet with the manager to discuss our findings, good or areas needing additional attention.

Unit is then moved to the delivery line for the detail line folks to thoroughly clean the unit inside and out and meet with QC once again.

Finally the unit is ready for the customers appointment for walk through by the QC person. The customer will sometimes arrive early but usually late throwing off the schedule, however we put on our best smile and begin the dog and pony show.

If they are upgrading to a better unit the walk through will not be as long as the newbe's but the QC person must be careful not to skip over items. First the outside is gone over explaining every option and what each accomplishes. Often questions come up that must be answered or acknowledge the question and answering "Good question... but we are not there yet". This way QC can stay on track with an organized walk around. Ladies usually head inside about this time.  Awning is usually the last outside item.

Finally inside the unit, QC will gather up the customers and begin at the entrance door opening every cabinet and drawer to show the quality of work and that every door/drawer closes properly. ON to appliances, electrical, TV antenna amplifier, Satellite system, couch, recliners, water filters, ETC. Every light is turned on and off

After 2 to 6 hours (6 for big bus) the customer is offered the opportunity to spend the night on site or go to a close by campground (paid by us) for an overnight stay. This way the customer can relax and verify that we the dealership has given them a unit to be proud of.  Do we still get calls about a problem? Yes, often it is operator error however sometime things break or seems to be not quite right. Those customers get priority service to make it right. We would rather take care of problems immediately not some time in the future.

My Summary: Every dealership SHOULD take time devoted to QC for the customer. The walk around SHOULD be an education process for all RVers no matter how much experience or time on the road. New products are available to make our RVing more enjoyable and should be discussed as information available not as trying to sell ya something. When a concern surfaces, the dealership should have a process in place to attack the problem no matter how small and if answers are not radially available, the next level of support is brought into the picture.

Obviously I enjoy working with campers to share options that I may have encountered through the years. Some of the stories I have listened to are funny but serious, usually followed by "OK..you forgot to ...... To fix that try ......"  Maybe I should get a 900 number at $3 bucks a minute.

Thanks for taking the time to read a quick summary of how a delivery is not just roll off the RV and put it up for sale!

Cheers 

 

[JDOnTheGo]

What you have listed here whiteva is a beautiful thing!  I wish all dealerships operated this way.  Maybe this level of detail comes from our aviation backgrounds.

 

[lmichel]

Yes whiteva,
Agreed you are above and beyond what I have ever seen.  I've purchased 4 RVs in my lifetime.  Not one was gone over nearly as thoroughly as you describe.  I know, because in each and every purchase, a drawer, door, knob or something similar was broken.  However, only the Outlaw (at the start of this thread) was a brand new purchase.  But all purchases were from a dealer and went through prep. 
After having so many issues with my Newmar (more than 10k in repairs per year for 3 years) I decided buying used was not the way to go.

Hopefully the 2016 Outlaw purchase will prove to be a better solution.  I'm so gun-shy from the Newmar, that I even purchased the platinum protection plan for the Outlaw.  I'm never one to do that type of thing!      I want to be able to point to practically anything not caused by normal wear and tear and say "Fix this please" - without concern for cost.   

At least it's nice to start my new RV and not wonder which idiot light is going to be asking me for money

- Lance

 

[jsetti]

We too bought a new Thor (ours was a Challenger 38KT).  During the PDI there was a problem with the "big" slide.  The dealership "fixed" it and we drove it off the lot.  For the next year we continued to have problems with the slide, we couldn't fill the fresh water tank more than 2/3 full or it would siphon out and the microwave/convection oven would not work (we had it replaced 5 times and never got to use it).  We also found a number of other smaller items that needed to be fixed, most of which my husband was able to take care of.

In our case, we found out that the dealer was primarily interested in selling, not doing warrantee work.  The factory didn't care how much warranty worked they had to do.  In fact when we were touring the facility we were told that the Quality Control people would tag everything that needed to be fixed and the people who were responsible for fixing whatever they had not done right the first time would just take the tags off.

Anyway, after a year of aggravation we traded in our new RV for a used RV.  We gave the dealership that we traded our Thor to a list of all the problems that still had not been corrected.  Hopefully they fixed them before they sold the unit to another unschooled RVer.

We had learned our lesson.  We made 3 trips to the dealer before we accepted the used RV which had several items that needed to be fixed and, in addition, spent 3 days on their lot running every system including the washer and dryer before we would drive off the lot.  That was when our warrantee began.

The dealership was very accommodating in letting us stay until we were satisfied that everything was working as it should.

This was our experience (yours may differ).  Caveat emptor!

 

[1PlasticMan1]

Whiteva.  What dealer do you "work" for?  I would seriously consider going there to get my next coach.  The hours and miles I took to get mine to the point as to what it should have been for delivery, could be worth the travel from NE PA.

 

[PBG]

I've often wondered why the drivers who deliver a new motorhome from the factory to the dealership don't make a list of the items that are not working properly so that they can be serviced before it's delivered to the buyer.

I've also wondered why the manufacturers don't make video tutorials available so that the new buyers can learn how systems work before taking ownership. It seems this could make for a smoother transition at the dealer level.

 

[workingtorv]

Whiteva.  What dealer do you "work" for?  I would seriously consider going there to get my next coach.  The hours and miles I took to get mine to the point as to what it should have been for delivery, could be worth the travel from NE PA.

Yes I would like to know too in case I ever buy a new one again.

 

[Alfa38User]

I've often wondered why the drivers who deliver a new motorhome from the factory to the dealership don't make a list of the items that are not working properly so that they can be serviced before it's delivered to the buyer.

I've also wondered why the manufacturers don't make video tutorials available so that the new buyers can learn how systems work before taking ownership. It seems this could make for a smoother transition at the dealer level.

The answer to the first part is simple, these drivers don't use the motor home, they simply drive it. They overnight in hotels, eat in restaurants, they are not allowed to use the new motor home and this is as part of their contract in most cases.

 

[Rene T]

The answer to the first part is simple, these drivers don't use the motor home, they simply drive it. They overnight in hotels, eat in restaurants, they are not allowed to use the new motor home and this is as part of their contract in most cases.

If they did, then it would be considered used don't ya think?  ;D

 

[DickHutchings]

I've also wondered why the manufacturers don't make video tutorials available so that the new buyers can learn how systems work before taking ownership. It seems this could make for a smoother transition at the dealer level.

Great idea! I would have watched it quite a few times by now. I get the walk through this Friday.

 

[Houston Remodeler]

After reading the forums, we used or TT for a spell, making a grocery list of the repair items. We dropped it off when we weren't fixin' to use the TT for a few months. Figured they'd have plenty of time to work on the list. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA What a newbie / stupid idea.

Quickly we determined the only reason to return to CW is for factory recalls. We fix everything else ourselves as we have the skills, and it's just not worth the distance, time, effort, headaches, or grey hairs dealing with the knuckleheads at CW.

Where do you work WhiteVA ?

 

[malexander]

Yeah, I fix all my own stuff too.
I figure if it isn't working, or there's something wrong with it, I really can't hurt it too much more.
It may take me a while to figure something out. But when I do, I have thorough understanding of how it works.