Winnebago, Are you reading?

[jackiemac]

I'd be asking them to make me an offer before I got a lawyer involved. That level of incompetence is criminal and could have led to serious injury.

 

[John Canfield]

I'd be asking them to make me an offer before I got a lawyer involved. That level of incompetence is criminal and could have led to serious injury.

Several have suggested he get an attorney involved but so far that's not what he wants to do.

 

[John Canfield]

If you want to know my opinion on what is going on, while not being a camper engineer, it is my belief that the under carriage framing is way to weak and surely not structurally engineered across the area of the slide. I think the metal on the framing itself is way too thin, of course probably because of an attempt of weight savings. Its surely not an I beam design, which is much better with the offset outriggers just bolted to the main beams.....

Could you make a sketch of the chassis, take a photo and put in a post? It would be interesting to see and maybe we'll get some engineering ideas.

 

[Boat Addict]

Several have suggested he get an attorney involved but so far that's not what he wants to do.

I don't air all my reasons out here. But I will do a digest version here. During the springtime when I was planning my trip, I would not have been able to use the camper for an extended period of time. I also would have been dealing with a major corporation across many state lines. the starting number was 4,000 bucks. My wife's health is in  a state that its quite possible that we would not be able to make the same trip next year.

Then the service facility operation shut down while a skeleton crew operated in the business end of it. So at that point I said what the heck and  rolled the dice and was planning on coming back to the factory after they opened up again, communicating this too before I left,  from the shutdown created by the virus in hopes that they would work with me.

All I got was lip service between periods of silence as we traveled across the country and back. So I ended up just wanting to get the camper back home safely, where I would access the issues better. Every time I have used this camper I have had issues, and not just minor stuff.


Currently we are in a more open dialogue, FWIW now with more incredible evidence that the camper is a disaster.  What happens is still unknown. But for now I cannot recommend  buying one of these TTs or surely not any brand from my local rv dealer.  And when I get a chance I will draw things out with measurements and pictures of course as usual. But things are all listed here for anyone to make their own decisions .

 

[Boat Addict]

I took white masking tape and marked the location for the outriggers from the main frame. The two areas , front and back of the tires are where they doubled up on the outriggers on the road side. Of course as the pictures will show, they did not extend to the top and bottom edges of the main frame, which is nothing but an "L" shaped frame. But none of the outriggers transfers any loads to the inner cross members inside the frame. So I feel confident in saying that where the outriggers land on the sides of the main frame that still has to be flexing while on the road. The largest span is 60 inches with 52 inches at the slide area.

Also I will include that the ends of the slides sides bulge out, as displayed by the straight edge level. So there are combined issues in play. . A point of note I think the doubled up outriggers were installed with the floor dropped down. If the outriggers were  larger they may be more rigid even without and backing up inside in those areas.  But still there is no real plans to do anything to upgrade this if its once again towed back to the factory.

And I put new tires on the camper before the trip that dealt with the wearing unevenly of the outside toes of the tires. And with going with load rated D Goodyear Endurance they did wear a bit better for the almost 7000 miles. But to put another 3,000 miles on the tires just to have the camper patched up again is not something that I am in favor for without a different approach from the last trip.

 

[John Canfield]

You can use a Gopro cam mounted to a frame rail to know for sure what's flexing.

 

[Boat Addict]

You can use a Gopro cam mounted to a frame rail to know for sure what's flexing.

That would not be enough for them.  The bits and pieces are coming apart, even distorted main walls, as represented by credible photos and admitted issues. My conclusion after almost 11 months of being patient, In addition to grocery stores selling lemons, the rv industry sells them too. At least the grocery stores take back rotten bags and boxes of stuff and replace them with a smile in most cases.

The camper could fall apart in the middle of the road and no one at Winnebago would give a damn at this point. Promises, promises and more promises to haul it back to the factory, extend warranty and once again work on it while loosing another month of use at minimum. But what good is any extension of any perceived warranty if it continually has to stay in a shop being worked on.

Every single time I have taken the camper out for any trip, even the three day trip during the hurricane of last year I had issues and have had to work on it  to try and minimize the issues during the one year's time of debugging that is supposed to come with buying new.


I understand  from years of making new stuff and tuning the parts to work properly in unison after being put in service that it does require some patience and work. I could spend thousands of dollars writing letters and hours of emails as the camper ages and devalues and I am of the belief now that I would go broke fighting for the right for a decent camper with  their latest babble. This is the absolute worse experience I have ever had from well named companies that's been in business for as many years as this company has been building assorted rvs.

The price of this camper to produce at the wholesale end is peanuts. It not the high end luxury bells and whistles . I don't need stuff like all those high end hundreds of thousands of dollars road warrior yachts. Just exchange the dang camper.

 

[jackiemac]

That is the least they could do in my opinion.  Fingers crossed.

 

[Boat Addict]

Just a quick update, the nightmare is over. But there are others locally dealing with the similar issues with similar results too. So I felt like enough was enough.  I dumped the camper for best offer. Its gone but will never be forgotten. So many promises from up the food chain after repeated communications, so nice too,,,,, but as soon as the one year warranty expired in the first of Aug.  all responses stopped. I had to cut my second trip short because of the repeated leaks and slide jamming.


And I was not going to spend another dime or another five minutes of working on it myself. I have purchased the most simple TT, used and seasoned , no slide, no fancy electrical junk and no sealed under belly either. And after about a week of digging thru it and adding some off the grid toys, back on the road again.  ) )

 

[X-Roughneck]

Sad to hear BA,

But Life it too short to dwell on it.  Mix a batch of that Trash Can Everclear Punch you were talking about on that one post you did awhile back. Wake up the next day and move on.  ;D

You can always share your story on a side bar chat on just how they screwed over the Common Guy. 

I will say that seems to be the norm with the exception of the Tiffin's which I think were or do Stand Behind their products A-Z.

WGO Lawyer defenders at the ready on payroll full time fighting the common man who dares to take on Goliath, I mean WGO. 

I am sure the WGO is Low bid in the game too keeping up with the THORs of the world for % of profit.  I am good with that, but these things are not cheap. 

I think equivalent to buying a fake Gucci purse.  Yea once upon a time, back in the day the name was Quality.

Comes down to Profit, the all mighty dollar, sales are Priority, and darn sure nothing there after.  Staff Lawyers ready to drain your pocket book if you even dare attempt to take on Goliath.

I mean Come on BA/David did you really think you could break their knee and get them to bend?

I still think Judge Judy would have been cool.  Probably after you put one tube of goop to divert the water flow it voided your entire House warranty anyway...LOL

Who knows but i am sure the warranty legal document is a stacked deck in Favor of them voiding the warranty because loop Hole B: You passed gas twice inside with the windows closed? The double whammy.

Does anybody read those things line by line anyway?

Gary probably? Might be too wordy for Gary even? 

I always scoffed at a extended warranty.  Pay get it repaired now get back in the Game. 

File warranty claim drag it out a year and get 0.

Guy told me about his house warranty.  OK 110F and takes 4 weeks for AC repair in Yuma Arizona? No warranty or paying for somebody to tell me to refer to section 226 F, Para Z. Sir the Policy does not cover that because you washed the compressor or what ever loophole.

Probably did not pass the leak test at the factory, somebody playing on their cell phone. smmmh

Sorry to Here that is how it played out, BA.

John

 

[Boat Addict]

Sad to hear BA,

But Life it too short to dwell on it.  Mix a batch of that Trash Can Everclear Punch you were talking about on that one post you did awhile back. Wake up the next day and move on.  ;D

You can always share your story on a side bar chat on just how they screwed over the Common Guy. 

I will say that seems to be the norm with the exception of the Tiffin's which I think were or do Stand Behind their products A-Z.

WGO Lawyer defenders at the ready on payroll full time fighting the common man who dares to take on Goliath, I mean WGO. 

I am sure the WGO is Low bid in the game too keeping up with the THORs of the world for % of profit.  I am good with that, but these things are not cheap. 

I think equivalent to buying a fake Gucci purse.  Yea once upon a time, back in the day the name was Quality.

Comes down to Profit, the all mighty dollar, sales are Priority, and darn sure nothing there after.  Staff Lawyers ready to drain your pocket book if you even dare attempt to take on Goliath.

I mean Come on BA/David did you really think you could break their knee and get them to bend?

I still think Judge Judy would have been cool.  Probably after you put one tube of goop to divert the water flow it voided your entire House warranty anyway...LOL

Who knows but i am sure the warranty legal document is a stacked deck in Favor of them voiding the warranty because loop Hole B: You passed gas twice inside with the windows closed? The double whammy.

Does anybody read those things line by line anyway?

Gary probably? Might be too wordy for Gary even? 

I always scoffed at a extended warranty.  Pay get it repaired now get back in the Game. 

File warranty claim drag it out a year and get 0.

Guy told me about his house warranty.  OK 110F and takes 4 weeks for AC repair in Yuma Arizona? No warranty or paying for somebody to tell me to refer to section 226 F, Para Z. Sir the Policy does not cover that because you washed the compressor or what ever loophole.

Probably did not pass the leak test at the factory, somebody playing on their cell phone. smmmh

Sorry to Here that is how it played out, BA.

John

Early on I conveyed the expected outcome. So I am not surprised. Its nothing to  the beam counters. But I have been instructed by forum management not to  speak ill , no matter how this horror show played out.  This chain of events are not some fluke. Lets just move along. I am rigging my new old camper and its going to be put thru the paces in the next two plus months. Then I will take  a break and then begin my new year with a cross country trip, if the good Lord continues to bless me with the ability to get up on all fours and stand on two. 8)

 

[Heli_av8tor]

"But I have been instructed by forum management not to  speak ill , no matter how this horror show played out."

I know there's always two sides to a story, but that still sucks.

 

[Tom]

[quote author=Boat Addict]... have been instructed by forum management not to  speak ill...[/quote]
Who said what? We have a set of forum rules that we all agree to when we join this forum. Berating a manufacturer violates those rules. Bot posting facts is fine.

 

[Boat Addict]

"But I have been instructed by forum management not to  speak ill , no matter how this horror show played out."

I know there's always two sides to a story, but that still sucks.

Now folks say there are two sides to every story? Yep you are correct.  After a year from the start of my issues of the doors and then having to go directly to the door manufacturer after being blow off to get two new ones to replace the warped ones that began leaking in Sept 2019,  to the floor humping up and the slide floor dropping, the kitchen cabinets pulling away from the side walls after the fasteners sheered off [yes more supporting photos] and the cabinets riding down the highway loose,  in an attempt to just start over and give the company the benefit of the doubt, this is what I wrote as late as Aug 31. I had good money in the camper and  I love the layout, the woodwork and wood and it worked really well for my wife  and wanted to still own one . I mean not all campers across all the years of the company building them could be as bad as this one.
?

I am searching for another camper.  While I understand that sometimes just like automobiles there are those vehicles and campers that ends up just being a lemon of sorts. I was very patient and willing to jump thru the hoops to bring the issues to some sort of satisfactory conclusion and did this since my original purchase date.

But I could not even get the factory to replace those cargo doors and it went down hill  from there. I am an understanding person and understand service issues in large scale production plants after having like products put into service. If the factory wants to offer me something different at the manufacturers cost then I am open to listen and will give it a second chance.

I never got the courtesy of a reply from anyone. For months I struggled to either resolve the problems or even exchange it. The sale resolved the issue for both parties and I bent over backwards to start over with a new one.

 

[Boat Addict]

author=Tom link=topic=127126.msg1181967#msg1181967 date=1599096808]
Who said what? We have a set of forum rules that we all agree to when we join this forum. Berating a manufacturer violates those rules. Bot posting facts is fine.

Your section moderator and I have spoke numerous times in a pleasant manner and an attempt to work behind the scenes with his contacts, which in fact was reportedly only in the motor home section.  It was only in my last post at the end of June after I returned from my first trip and the factory was back working with a partial crew and without any success  that I may have been out of the stated boundary and we discussed it. But If you review my entire contributions on the issues of the camper from the beginning, you will find that I have presented facts and mostly all backed up with photos in a civil manner. This has been reinforced by comments too behind the scenes too.  This began in earnest approx. nine months ago.



The camper was hauled back to the factory and came back in the same condition with two exceptions, two new outriggers installed. But that was only one part of the problems and did not correct anything in the area of the slide and floor , My wife and I attempted to correct one of the major problems, which was water pouring into the side of the slide and into the floor. Once again photos were provided relating to that issue. 

. My original post after joining was an inquiry to learn if anyone else had experienced problems on their Winnebagos under the manufacturer's section, which I read was a dedicated section for the brand. Nothing more or nothing less,,  I came back from my first trip out west and also provided substantive comments and photos as I attempted to work thru the on going  issues.  As  a matter of fact the original exchanges with the factory came around the first of Nov, IIRC right now after  the selling dealer failed to follow up on several issues including acquiring new cargo doors that had warped and was allowing gallons of water into the bedroom floor and storage materials as I drove down the highway.


I was very patient for several months with the virus shutdown and attempted to use the camper while  the factory had the partial shutdown and was asked directly to be patient until they opened back up and was promised that my issues would be dealt with by the main service manager. This is exactly what I did. But then the communications became scarce to non-existent .

I began my second trip after going over what I thought was the main leaking areas.  I also communicated with the factory after promises to generate an additional year of warranty and plans to take the camper back and work on it was in the works..  I was told that the extended warranty matters are done thru their Iowa plant on Aug 5,

[I have been in contact with our department purchases the extended warranty packages for us ]

but I never heard any follow up. I followed up on Aug. 9 and heard back from them on Aug 11. They were supposed to book a date for the camper to return once again at the end of Sept. I ask them again about any updates on the warranty as my original one was running out on Aug. 13. I still heard nothing from them after another follow up note .

Anyway we left on another trip after an agreement to work on it again and got to Arkansas and was forced to turn around and return home after informing the service facility that the slide had once again jammed out of wack or alignment on aug 17 and water running on the top of the slide and inside on the floor.    I  followed up and relayed this to the factory and got a note back on Aug 18  saying okay.  But I had still heard nothing pertaining to getting the camper in earlier or any extended warranty confirmation.

I got home and got the slide back aligned and working. But I did not even attempt to take it back to the road. I waited and finally a guy came back and purchased the camper as is. I had had enough. After two weeks this is when I actually offered to purchase another one with the exact layout as represented in my reply above this response. I believe in being civil, even though sometimes frustration takes over after such a length of time. All of my replies on this issue represented facts and all supported by photos. Thanks for the chance to respond with more indepth details.

 

[John Canfield]

"But I have been instructed by forum management not to  speak ill , no matter how this horror show played out."  I know there's always two sides to a story, but that still sucks.

To add to what Tom said, this thread by Boat Addict is a great example of sticking with the facts of the situation without going off on a rant and is compliant with forum rules. When frustration turns to anger and that anger reaches the keyboard is usually when trouble starts and then moderation happens.

I worked with BA behind the scenes to see if I could get him more help through my Winnebago contacts but unfortunately that wasn't ultimately fruitful.

 

[Tom]

[quote author=John Canfield]I worked with BA behind the scenes to see if I could get him more help through my Winnebago contacts but unfortunately that wasn't ultimately fruitful.[/quote]
Aye John, you have some good contacts and have used them well to help forum members over the years. Sorry it didn't work out for Boat Addict.

 

[Heli_av8tor]

Boat Addict, By saying there's always two sides I didn't mean to infer that you had slanted your posts in any way. It's clear that "the other side" of the story is stall, stall, stall and the problem will fade away.

Sorry you had to endure this. I would have expected more from this company.

 

[Boat Addict]

Thank you folks for all the attempted help and replies and the shoulder to convey a horrible nightmare that we never woke up from, so to speak until the camper went out of the driveway.  Luckily for the new owner there was some improvements that I had made from the original build and sale of the unit to me. But it will not be a full time road warrior though. But he will have a better experience, if used lightly or as a local get away. I started this particular thread with a thread title in hopes that there would be a nudge and some feedback from the factory, since I understood that the factory supported this section  as a side bar of sorts. Of course that never happened.

But I found a used Jayco and went back to a simple, no slide, aluminum sides and older one to get by with for now that needs a little freshening up, with a almost new inside interior, but with the mechanical parts that's been sitting for a while. This is a brand that I owned for ten years several decades ago.

I contacted their service department at the factory for a couple of items and even though they said they do not sell parts I heard back from them within a couple of hours with direct contact numbers  in my region with a pleasant attitude even being a second owner and arranged to purchase the parts in about ten minutes. I hope to be on the road again in for the fall leaves season if the hurricane season is kind to us and we do not have to rebuild anything. 

If we can get by with this camper until after the first of the year we will do several shows and again look for something new and see if there is something that comes out and we can update. If not we will burn the roads up with this unit until something better and probably used comes available. Maybe some of the units that's been sold during the buying frenzy will become available too with big saving, but something I can work with that's not too big. I really don't need anything over 24 foot for just the two of us and the dog of course , with me being just the chauffeur driving Ms.  Daisy cross country.

 

[Tom]

FWIW it's been many years since Winnebago or any RV manufacturer monitored this forum. They (Winnebago) did, however, support us by advertising here, thanks again to John's contacts.