ok, sounds like I just bought more 5th wheel than my truck should handle

[elm_tx]

I have a 2013 Chevy 2500 Diesel Crew Cab 4x4 short bed.
I bought a 2015 Raptor 375TS with no plans to put 'TOYS" in the garage.
I pretty much only travel within 250 miles of Houston Tx, no plans to head across county

What are your thoughts, did I buy too much  trailer, or for my purposes, I should be ok. Don't really want to buy a new truck, will add air bags if that will help.

Thanks
Eddie

 

[steveblonde]

Hopefully some others will chime in currently depending upon the weight of your wife and yourself and i gave you a weight allowance of 300 lbs total you are 1500 lbs over the gvwr on your truck the following is an awesome guide.

http://www.oregon.gov/odot/ts/docs/veheq/towing_trailer.pdf

Air bags are NOT going to change any rating getting additional springs and getting the truck re-certified will. Problem is you are grossly overweight. Min 1500 lbs

See link to op other post
http://www.rvforum.net/SMF_forum/index.php/topic,90276.0.html

Cheers sorry not trying to burst your bubble just trying to keep you safe and not kill you or the truck

 

[BruceinFL]

Just curious. Why buy a toy hauler if you are not going to haul toys or "stuff"?

 

[steveblonde]

Just curious. Why buy a toy hauler if you are not going to haul toys or "stuff"?

The " garage" makes a great guest room,laundry room, dog room, dining room, mud room, etc etc the table fold to a bed the top bunk raises and lowers out of the way when not in use,
I put dogs, and dogs houses ( my dogs are 90 and 75lbs ea) a freezer, washer dryers, beer fridge, ice maker, wake boards and surf boards, kids and grandkids, its not a garage as much as a very very versatile room with a door to separate it.we have had many many trailers and none really stood up to our life style a toy hauler fits that bill we are very active wake surfers and live in a harsher environment than most

 

[OLDRACER]

Well at least you don't have any toys back there.

 

[grashley]

The Payload on your truck is about 2700 #. The MAXIMUM weight your truck is designed to carry is 2700 #.  Bigger tires, air bags, helper  springs, etc. do not change this limit.  Driving on flat terrain close to home does not change this limit.

The DRY pin wt of the Raptor, according to the Keystone web site is 3460#.  Now add the weight of the hitch.  Now add passengers and cargo.  YOU ARE HALF A TON OVERWEIGHT!!  Adding "toys" actually will lower pin weight slightly, but only by 100 - 200 #

YOUR 2500 TRUCK CANNOT HANDLE THIS CAMPER. 

 

[Rene T]

Something else to think about, are your brakes capable of stopping your truck and trailer?

 

[donn]

Something else to think about, are your brakes capable of stopping your truck and trailer?

2500 and 3500 brakes are identical.  Besides TV brakes are not designed to stop 19,000 pounds worth of trailer.
But grashley has it right.  Scaled weight of the truck ready to travel is going to be around 7500-8000 pounds.  Trucks GVWR I believe is 10,000 pounds.  Leaving a scant 2000-2500 pounds for cargo (pin).  The OP is going to be grossly overloaded before he puts one single item into the trailer.  He really really needs a dually!  Actually at over 14K advertised shipping weight the OP really should have a MDT to handle a 19K+ fifthwheel

 

[TonyDtorch]

a little story about truck GVW's.

For about 35 years I drove 26K-54k company work trucks towing 20k trailers for a living on the freeways right next to you and your families.

many times those trucks were so badly overloaded that the springs would break and brand new tires would actually melt.
 
We were often told by the companies to take the long way to the job, sometimes we would drive an hour out of the way to bypass scales. Sometime we got caught and they found the trucks as muck as 10k over GVW.

But....We always made it to the job and back without anyone being killed, ( the fleet mechanics were our hero's )..



Point being...a GVW is only a bunch of attorneys and engineers estimate of what that truck can haul/tow without the manufacture being sued.

Drive smart... and you can exceed the GVW on any vehicle,  and still drive it safely.

 

[Rene T]

2500 and 3500 brakes are identical.  Besides TV brakes are not designed to stop 19,000 pounds worth of trailer.

I didn't know that Donn. I do know that I had a 1997 Dodge dually and the brake drums and shoes on that were humongous.  Thanks for enlightening me. 

 

[steveblonde]

trailer rating for that truck is 15,800 lbs max payload is    2706  lbs
ship weight on that trailer is  14,215 lbs dry  pin weight is 3460  lbs

http://www.chevrolet.com/content/dam/Chevrolet/northamerica/usa/nscwebsite/en/Home/Help%20Center/Download%20a%20Brochure/02_PDFs/MY13%20Silverado%20HD%20eBrochure.pdf

http://www.keystonerv.com/previous-years?brand=Raptor&year=2015

as we can see DRY Weight he is 754 lbs over cargo capacity  before adding a passenger, a hitch, or a newspaper lol

max tow weight he is under 1585lbs BUT when Raptor does the shop weights is a bare bones base model - the list of potions can add up to well more than 1600lbs
MaxFlo 15,000 BTU Zone Controlled Air Conditioner
2nd Air Conditioner
3rd Air Conditioner
Euro Style Chair
Cummins/Onan 5,500 Watt Gas Generator
Frameless Dual Pane Windows
Rear Patio Screen Door
Electric Beds with Dual Opposing Flip-Down Sofas
Rear Ramp Patio with Electric Awning and Steps
131? Sofa with Recliners (415 and 424 only)
High Definition Paint - Red, Blue or Orange
6 Point Hydraulic Auto Leveling
Garmin Backup Camera with Navigation
Dinette Seat with Slider Top (412, 425 Only)
Slide Out Storage Tray


no way that truck should pull that trailer

'99 % of the time those trucks were so badly overloaded that the springs would break and the tires would actually melt and come apart. 
We were always told by the companies to drive around scales, sometimes we would drive an hour out of the way to bypass scales.
Sometime we got caught and they found the trucks 3-4 thousand pounds over weight.

But....We always made it to the job and back without anyone being killed,  you actually can exceed the GVW on any vehicle and it will still drive it safely..... if you drive smart."

this quote is very poor advise - sorry

"a GVW is only the attorneys and engineers estimate of what that truck can haul/tow without the manufacture being sued. "

this quote is correct there are many "FUDGE" factor and the manufactures have themselves covered

 

[OLDRACER]

a little story about truck GVW's.

For about 35 years I drove 26K-54k work trucks for a living.

99 % of the time those trucks were so badly overloaded that the springs would break and the tires would actually melt.
 
We were told every morning by the companies to take the long way around scales, sometimes we would drive an hour out of the way to bypass scales.
Sometime we got caught and they found the trucks 3-4 thousand pounds over weight.

But....We always made it to the job and back without anyone being killed, 

a GVW is only the attorneys and engineers estimate of what that truck can haul/tow without the manufacture being sued.

Drive smart and you actually can exceed the GVW on any vehicle,  and still drive it safely......

Truth be told, you were very lucky and got away with all those years of lawbreaking and endangering the lives of your fellow citizens, but a lot of other truck drivers did not, we read about it every day. Apparently you and your company are above the law, and to H with the rest of us. Arrogant!

 

[steveblonde]

Truth be told, you were very lucky and got away with all those years of lawbreaking and endangering the lives of your fellow citizens, but a lot of other truck drivers did not, we read about it every day. Apparently you and your company are above the law, and to H with the rest of us. Arrogant!

amen to that 

 

[TonyDtorch]

all true...

and it's still happening more than you know.

let's pass another law to protect us all.

 

[SargeW]

RV weight threads are always sensitive threads, and many of us have strong opinions. But lets keep the comments civil or I will shut it down. 

That being said, I do not condone running over weight either. And yes, safety is the major factor. I have seen glaring examples of too small of  a truck trying to pull a giant trailer. I just hope I am not in front of them descending a hill when his brakes finally fail. 

As for companies that condone running over weight vehicles, I view it as not if there is a looming disaster,  it is when. So I too cannot condone the OP for having bought too much trailer for his truck. How he goes about remedying the problem is a decision he has  to make.

 

[Joezeppy]

The timing of this discussion is very interesting for me - I've just recently gotten myself into a "too heavy" situation. We just traded our TT for a 5th wheel. I thought I did the homework but missed on the truck's GVWR a bit. When I was calculating, I went by memory what the truck weighed with a full tank and me in the seat - my memory was off by about 400 lbs.


All other weights (axle, tow, GCW) are well within specs. IF we are closer to 20% than 25% pin weight and IF we don't put anything else in the bed of the truck and IF we don't have the kids with us, we'll be ok. Otherwise, we're overweight. We don't have any "mountains" to speak of here on the East coast and we will not be traveling more than a few hours away for the next several years. Could I do it? Yes. Will I? No. To me, it's just not worth it.


I love my current truck so it was a bittersweet call to a dealer friend of mine who is now on the hunt for a gently used 1-ton Duramax for me.


So, to the OP's question and using the various weights presented in this discussion, I'd recommend upgrading.

 

[TonyDtorch]

Yes people,  and the truth is.... it is very, very unlikely any police or highway patrol will ever weight that truck or trailer...  even in an accident ...because the driver is just another  unknowing "non professional'  RV driver . 

That being said,    >>> ( I.M.O. ) <<<<<.....

it is still very possible for a good, commons sense equipped, everyday non professional driver, to  safely drive a  slightly  "over loaded" vehicle.

Yes....it will prematurely wear out your existing tuck,  and you will need to decide to pay that cost.... or what the cost of a F350 or Ram 3500 or Freightliner or whatever truck,  falls within the factory engineers recommended absolute maximum estimated GCVW.

....( it is simply amazing those engineers can even tell your speed, terrain, weather/temperature, driving experience and all.. in that estimate ...)

 

[Gary RV_Wizard]

Agree, Tony. The wheels don't fall off just because the GVWR was exceeded by 1 lb. Or even several hundred. But it's still an really undesirable situation.

 

[OLDRACER]

Slightly overloaded is a lot different from "breaking the springs and melting the tires".

Another consideration is that in a crash, the other guy's insurance company and/ or lawyer will certainly investigate and place the blame on you if overloaded.

Same concept as having a brake system for your "toad". Probably drive forever without it and compensate, but not worth the liability in any accident.

 

[TonyDtorch]

Agree, Tony. The wheels don't fall off just because the GVWR was exceeded by 1 lb. Or even several hundred. But it's still an really undesirable situation.

But there are a lot of people that feel a GCVW is an absolute.. a go, or no-go number,